Hanako's Broken Heart Club

[Broomhead]

... Dunno what the explanation was, but he saved you some heartbreak down the road. My heart sings for you, but the mind says that it was better than being stood up for sommat. Sorry though.

[Lockhart]

Hello again,

apologies for not responsing sooner. I'm glad there's been so many replies, it shows this is an important topic.

I don't argue, I'm here to make a point. That doesn't mean I'm not ready to debate, but you can't expect me to answer posts that include insults or begin with an interjection.

I think there’s a big difference between not being a doormat and being a jerk, however. So much crap is spewed about being manly and a real man and what a real man should do as opposed to just being yourself and having confidence and self respect behind it. I worry that it leads to the unrealistic expectations as Lockhart has given that a well built, masculine and confident guy won’t get rejected, because that suggests only those sort of guys will succeed.

Even the best looking and most experienced guys get rejected all the time. The point is that you don't take rejection as a signal that something is wrong with you - every girl is different, and it's not realistic to expect to click with all of them. Failure is a chance to improve, not an excuse to despair, that goes for both dating girls and life in general.

Manosphere is about self improvement for guys. PUA (pick up artistry) is just a part of it, in reality a lot of those blogs deal with working out, handling stress, being successful at your job/business, life philosophy, web marketing, and societal issues of the western world. PUA part is the most known and has it's share of bad seeds, but that doesn't mean it doesn't work and that in itself is somehow negative.

There is no such thing as "alpha" and "beta." They are terms people use to define themselves because they can't come up with a personality on their own.

When you boil what he said down to its essence, all he's saying is "never let your girl know she's irreplaceable, because then she'll treat you like garbage. Make sure she knows you can replace her so she'll treat you right."

How many times have you seen a guy or a girl dating someone who is "way out of their league"? You'll see a fat guy with a gym bunny or someone who looks like Brad Pitt dating what looks like the school librarian. It's nothing to do with them being "alpha" or not. What it usually comes down to is self confidence and self respect. If you have that, you will draw the attention of the opposite sex, and your relationships will be more meaningful than people who only want you because you're a body builder or supermodel.

Alphas may have an easier time hooking up when they're young with people who are just as shallow, but if they keep that attitude, they're the ones who still hang out at the bars in their 30s telling the chick they're trying to get with what a bitch their 3rd ex-wife is.

You can't divide the entire male population into alpha and beta categories, but everyone is leaning towards one or another. We can introduce terms like "greater beta", "lesser alpha" and "gamma" for those guys that absolutely never get laid. But that's beside the point, which is that we all should work on improving ourselves and strive to become alpha.

If you see a fat guy with a gym bunny that's because the fat guy posesses skills like charm, humor, wealth and status. As men we are in somewhat better position as women, since no matter our looks we can improve ourselves to a point where we can still date at least reasonably hot girls. Self improvement works for girls as well, but to a lesser degree, since they are limited with their given looks. Guys like Brad Pitt that date school librarians (not the best analogy, since of course Yuuko comes to everyone's mind, but I assume you mean an unattractive girl) either arent aware of their own value, or perhaps the librarian simply has great girl game and a loads of other qualities.

It can work both ways, but I'd argue seeing Brad Pitt with a librarian usually means the guy is beta as hell, or simply got lured into a marriage by "accidental" pregnancy.

You say alphas have an easier time hooking up with people who are shallow. Are you saying that girls who prefer strong, confident leader-type men are shallow? If that's the case, all girls must be shallow, which would be really bad news. In reality they aren't shallow at all, they just prefer masculine men, just like men prefer feminine girls.

The same qualities that enable a man to have sex with a lots of girls make him a good long term partner. The only difference is that he chose to settle down instead of sleep around. Let's recap what those qualities are again - in good shape, intelligent, successful at his job/business, confident, creative.

These are the traits we should strive for, no matter what our goal in life is.

Although looks aren't everything, they're detrimental to a strong romantic relationship
If you don't like your girls chunky, you probably wont date one who is.

Us men are a very visual creatures and naturally prefer youthful, feminine, and overall good looking girls. Research has shown that women, until they enter their 30s, prefer men that are slightly older than them. Meanwhile, men of all ages prefer 20 year olds.

http://heartiste.wordpress.com/2014/06/ ... wo-charts/

As far as "big" girls go, no one but a few chubby fetishists likes them.

I am alpha and omega; the beginning and the end

That's a great attitude.

A man is nothing without a goal he is driven forwards. The best recipe for life is to select a goal, set down a specific plan how to achieve it - the planning part is just as important as having a goal, many people have "goals" but are afraid think about how to actually reach them - then get obsessed and just go for it.

You can forget everything I've written above if you follow your goal like a maniac. When you become good at something, girls come. Like moths are attracted to the light, girls are attracted to highly driven men.

Yeah, he is a little bitter, but criticize him as if he had no right to complain, will not really help him (except put in deeper in a feel of persecution)
You know, people dn' change their bad habits or opinions as you say it is not good or that you criticize them in a so insensitive way.

Ha ha, thanks for caring about my emotional well-being. I'm not posting here to recieve any kind of affirmation (as I said, I could go to any manosphere blog or forum to get that), but to share knowledge. All of us are drawn to lock ourselves into bubbles with people that agree with us on almost everything, because it's easier and we can pretend that "everyone thinks that way". It's good to break out every once in a while.

I understand some of what I wrote can be difficult to digest, but such is life. I've had a good amount of quality relationships with girls, and a few horrible ones. I wouldn't take anything back though, you can learn a lot from your mistakes.

Like buddhists say, there's no right or wrong, just skillful and unskillful actions. It's important to develop certain skills to enjoy the life to its fullest.

[brythain]

I think like attracts like for certain things. Too much like also tends to reduce resource levels through competition, but too much unlike doesn't reach the interactive stage in the first place. I also believe that 'alpha' and 'beta' and what-have-you are just reification of complexity; it's clear at all levels of biology that having excess resource levels or resource potentials is an attractive proposition.

At the same time 'resource' varies: the most obvious things are energy, power, wealth etc—things that keep you alive in an obvious sense. The more subtle things are things like information, stealth, etc—those are more complex and easier to cock-up, which is why they're not so obvious. But if you stick to the biological level, then only one outcome becomes important: did you disseminate your genetic material successfully?

At the sociocultural level, it becomes: did you disseminate your memetic payload successfully? Again, having high basic resource levels helps in that, but now the game is more complex—a starving artist can die, and many years later, successfully disseminate a memetic payload. That artist will then be remembered long after the alpha personality of that generation is dust.

[LilyKitsune]

Hello again,

apologies for not responsing sooner. I'm glad there's been so many replies, it shows this is an important topic.

I don't argue, I'm here to make a point. That doesn't mean I'm not ready to debate, but you can't expect me to answer posts that include insults or begin with an interjection.

The "points" you were trying to make were already an insult. Even if they weren't, to suggest that a point couldn't have been made if there was an insult in there is even more ridiculous. Of course I can expect you to answer those. There is no reasonable expectation that you wouldn't respond to something that made an argument based on logic, even if it contained calling a spade a spade.

Even the best looking and most experienced guys get rejected all the time. The point is that you don't take rejection as a signal that something is wrong with you - every girl is different,

It's funny you'd say that, because I'd like to introduce you to this guy I know. He says things like:

The moment you start to treat your girl as the only one, the princess, sweetypie, you will signal that she has complete power over you. There is nothing more resentful to a woman than a guy who sees her as an only option.

Because that means he doesn't have other options, which in turn means his value is low. He stops being a man and becomes a dog.

Youtube "marriage proposal fail". What's a common trait of those guys? See how feminine/out of shape/nerdy they all are? See how submissive their posture is, how quick are they to kneel and call their woman the best thing in the entire world, ever?
understand that the fantasy of every woman is to be with an alpha male, who could cheat if he wanted to, but doesn't.

I think you two have a lot to talk about, being that you've said two different things like three days apart. Go!

Manosphere is about self improvement for guys. PUA (pick up artistry) is just a part of it, in reality a lot of those blogs deal with working out, handling stress, being successful at your job/business, life philosophy, web marketing, and societal issues of the western world. PUA part is the most known and has it's share of bad seeds, but that doesn't mean it doesn't work and that in itself is somehow negative.

Yeah, no it isn't. It's about being better to get women. It's about comparing yourselves, not about bettering yourself. Competition is fine. Comparing is not. The difference is, in a competition, people know they are competing. Ever walk down the street with someone and they abruptly jump in front of you to some imagined finish line and declare "I win" and you're left with that feeling of "okay, whatever makes you feel better" ? That's the difference. That's what this is about. Creating an arbitrary goal of being with more women, and declaring yourselves "alpha" because of it. There would be no reason to assign these terms if that was what it was about.

You can't divide the entire male population into alpha and beta categories, but everyone is leaning towards one or another. We can introduce terms like "greater beta", "lesser alpha" and "gamma" for those guys that absolutely never get laid. But that's beside the point, which is that we all should work on improving ourselves and strive to become alpha.

If you see a fat guy with a gym bunny that's because the fat guy posesses skills like charm, humor, wealth and status. As men we are in somewhat better position as women, since no matter our looks we can improve ourselves to a point where we can still date at least reasonably hot girls. Self improvement works for girls as well, but to a lesser degree, since they are limited with their given looks. Guys like Brad Pitt that date school librarians (not the best analogy, since of course Yuuko comes to everyone's mind, but I assume you mean an unattractive girl) either arent aware of their own value, or perhaps the librarian simply has great girl game and a loads of other qualities.

It can work both ways, but I'd argue seeing Brad Pitt with a librarian usually means the guy is beta as hell, or simply got lured into a marriage by "accidental" pregnancy.

Yeah, similar terms that have little importance and are mostly joked about. Assigning these terms is a comparison, not a competition. Comparison is insecurity. You know that guy going through the midlife crisis, looking at his house like it's not good enough, looking at his bank account like it's not good enough, looking at his wife like a status symbol and nothing more and thinking she's not good enough? Good enough for who? It's comparison. It's insecurity. That's what you are preaching. Insecurity, just like the fat chicks that push "real women have curves" on others. You can't or don't want to escape that insecurity, so you drag others into it.

Y Are you saying that girls who prefer strong, confident leader-type men are shallow? If that's the case, all girls must be shallow, which would be really bad news. In reality they aren't shallow at all, they just prefer masculine men, just like men prefer feminine girls.

Funny you should say that, because I'd like to introduce you to this guy I know.
He says things like this:

Even the best looking and most experienced guys get rejected all the time. The point is that you don't take rejection as a signal that something is wrong with you - every girl is different,

You two will have a lot to talk about.
It's interesting how quickly you betray your own philosophy because you run into areas where it doesn't make sense. It's impressive that you can ignore that contradiction and just keep going like it didn't happen.

Us men are a very visual creatures and naturally prefer youthful, feminine, and overall good looking girls. Research has shown that women, until they enter their 30s, prefer men that are slightly older than them. Meanwhile, men of all ages prefer 20 year olds.

As far as "big" girls go, no one but a few chubby fetishists likes them.

Tell that to people from 100+ years ago.

I'd like if you'd respond to my initial post, but I doubt that will ever happen, given the way you ignore things(including your own statements) that ruin your beliefs. My, that sounds familiar.

[CoffeeDrive]

PEWPEWPEWPPEWPEPWEPW ratatatatata bang bang

Shots everywhere.

[brythain]

PEWPEWPEWPPEWPEPWEPW ratatatatata bang bang
Shots everywhere.

Circular logic with circular self-firing squad has also been detected.

[ogorhan]

Ahem

[LilyKitsune]

I dont do well with vague subjects online. =/

I've no idea who any of you are talking to or about.

[metalangel]

I'm not really seeing how a forum about a VN is the sort of place to discuss the 'Manosphere' when there are scores of relationship and dating forums out there much better suited to receiving such a topic.

[brythain]

I'm not really seeing how a forum about a VN is the sort of place to discuss the 'Manosphere' when there are scores of relationship and dating forums out there much better suited to receiving such a topic.

Apparently this is a Jigoro live role-play.

[Munchenhausen]

I dont do well with vague subjects online. =/
I've no idea who any of you are talking to or about.

It's best to just pull your head down and ignore it all

[LilyKitsune]

I dont do well with vague subjects online. =/
I've no idea who any of you are talking to or about.

It's best to just pull your head down and ignore it all

I don't wanna.

[Eurobeatjester]

Keep spewing what you need to to make yourself feel better about being dumped. We've all been there at one time or another.

I could break down your reply line by line but there would be no point. It's easier to just go "Aw, that's cute," and move on.

Let's discuss something more pleasant. I'll start us off.

What's your ideal first date to take someone on?
What's your ideal first date to be taken on?

[Broomhead]

What's your ideal first date to take someone on?
What's your ideal first date to be taken on?

Somewhere quiet and serene, perhaps woods or a cliff over a beach. Not too many people or sounds. Perhaps a light picnic, a little cranberry/apple juice, a sandwich or two, and a fruit of somesort. The day would be warm, perhaps a bit too warm for most people, actually (~69-73F or ~20.5-22.7C is my ideal), and the sun would be most of the way risen or set.

Now, I'm rather comfortable with my self and anyone I choose to take on a date, so that may be a bit too much for most. Also, the improbability of it being 72F at sunset/rise puts a hamper on things.

P.S.: After I wrote this, I realize how close, visually, LIlly's Confession is to this.

[metalangel]

The ideal first date is one where there's mutual attraction and connection. I don't care about the venue or activity as long as there's those two things.