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I never thought I'd actually come up with an idea for a KS thread, yet here I am after accidentally stumbling into one such idea. Weird how things sometimes turn out.

I was hanging out all by my lonesome when my random stream of thoughts carried me to the only time I ever had an art teacher*. This led me to think of my years in the finest school I ever went to, which I jokingly referred to as my "Yamaku experience" due to my relatively tranquil time there (despite the lack of disabled students, funding, et al., it was a small and secluded school of almost sui generis predisposition). That thought and the school's microscopic size led me to think about Yamaku's student body, structure, etc. I'm sure Yamaku isn't a small establishment, but its scale is never exactly described as far as I remember, and it's not like we meet that many students to begin with.

Which leads to the topic in question: What is the size of the Yamaku student body and just how expansive is the school property itself?

I'm willing to bet someone can conjure up mystifying numbers by calculating the grades and classes or something. I'm horrible with math, so feel free to enlighten the math-dumb.

Feel free to talk about the Japanese education system too (in contrast to Western ones) or other related stuff, I don't know. I ain't picky. Besides, it might offer good research for aspiring fanfic writers who don't know a thing about that subject.

Apologies if this has been answered or previously posted elsewhere in advance, if it has I'll take a link to that answer and run off somewhere—probably back to the fanfiction board.


* I know what you're thinking. Don't worry, the teacher was nothing like Nomiya; he was in shape, for one, wore a ponytail and looked rather French or Italian, although it's possible he was simply a Spaniard. You know the type, probably. The music teacher, on the other hand... Oof.

The size of Yamaku student body can differ from Misha to Emi. But I prefer Misha-size Yamaku student body, if you know what I mean.

As for Yamaku school building and school grounds size, I think it's 2 to 3 football fields, not counting nearby parks and forests that aren't school property.

We kind of sort of have answers to both of those.

According to the Devs, there are four third-year classes (3-1, 3-2, 3-3, and 3-4). 3-1 is specifically for deaf students, 3-2 for blind. Hisao's class is 3-3, and Emi and Rin are in 3-4. If we use 3-3 as a basis, there are 18 seats per class. On the other hand, Hisao lives on a wing with just him and Kenji, leaving empty rooms. So there's the implication that Yamaku is not at peak enrollment. I'd conclude that there are fewer than 72 (18x4) third-year students, then. Japanese high schools cover three years, so you'd have similar numbers for the lower years; perhaps a bit larger (classes naturally diminish as they progress in years due to dropouts and such; mortality is probably also a non-trivial factor at Yamaku).

We can thus estimate that the current student body is around 216 students, give or take.

As for facilities and grounds, we know that classes, admin offices, medical facilities, a cafeteria, and a pool are all housed in a main building and an auxiliary building, which are connected. There is an underpopulated men's dorm as well as a women's dorm. The ratio of girls to guys is roughly 60-40, so we could perhaps assume that both dorms are equally sized, with fewer vacancies for the girls. So, based on class sizes, let's assume that the dorms can hold 125-150 each. Each student seems to get their own room, so we're talking pretty good-sized dorm buildings here.

On top of these four buildings, we know that there's an athletic field and a moderate amount of open green spaces. Using my (admittedly poor) estimate of sizes and spaced, I think Yamaku could easily cover maybe 5-10 acres.

Of course, this is all based on an upper limit of 4 classes per year. There was no upper limit established in the VN, and the devs have been quick to qualify their statements as not really being canon unless you want them to be.

Feel free to talk about the Japanese education system too (in contrast to Western ones) or other related stuff, I don't know.

Then I hope you don't mind if I add a question of my own. What are those important exams about? Do those mark the end of the term? Initially I thought they marked the end of their overall high school career, but that doesn't seem to be the case in all routes at least. Are they the same exams in every route where they come up? As I understand it, only Shizune's route explicitly shows their last day of school ever. Lilly's route on the other hand indicates that they will be back after the summer holidays.

Sorry, I am still new to this and haven't had enough time for careful replaying.

ProfAllister wrote:We kind of sort of have answers to both of those.

According to the Devs, there are four third-year classes (3-1, 3-2, 3-3, and 3-4). 3-1 is specifically for deaf students, 3-2 for blind. Hisao's class is 3-3, and Emi and Rin are in 3-4. If we use 3-3 as a basis, there are 18 seats per class. On the other hand, Hisao lives on a wing with just him and Kenji, leaving empty rooms. So there's the implication that Yamaku is not at peak enrollment. I'd conclude that there are fewer than 72 (18x4) third-year students, then. Japanese high schools cover three years, so you'd have similar numbers for the lower years; perhaps a bit larger (classes naturally diminish as they progress in years due to dropouts and such; mortality is probably also a non-trivial factor at Yamaku).

We can thus estimate that the current student body is around 216 students, give or take.

As for facilities and grounds, we know that classes, admin offices, medical facilities, a cafeteria, and a pool are all housed in a main building and an auxiliary building, which are connected. There is an underpopulated men's dorm as well as a women's dorm. The ratio of girls to guys is roughly 60-40, so we could perhaps assume that both dorms are equally sized, with fewer vacancies for the girls. So, based on class sizes, let's assume that the dorms can hold 125-150 each. Each student seems to get their own room, so we're talking pretty good-sized dorm buildings here.

On top of these four buildings, we know that there's an athletic field and a moderate amount of open green spaces. Using my (admittedly poor) estimate of sizes and spaced, I think Yamaku could easily cover maybe 5-10 acres.

Of course, this is all based on an upper limit of 4 classes per year. There was no upper limit established in the VN, and the devs have been quick to qualify their statements as not really being canon unless you want them to be.

impressive , cooooool
ProfAllister , you are good in detective and word knowledge memories <so coool>
Nice.
"Well Done"

Ritter Delorges wrote:

Feel free to talk about the Japanese education system too (in contrast to Western ones) or other related stuff, I don't know.

Then I hope you don't mind if I add a question of my own. What are those important exams about? Do those mark the end of the term? Initially I thought they marked the end of their overall high school career, but that doesn't seem to be the case in all routes at least. Are they the same exams in every route where they come up? As I understand it, only Shizune's route explicitly shows their last day of school ever. Lilly's route on the other hand indicates that they will be back after the summer holidays.

Sorry, I am still new to this and haven't had enough time for careful replaying.

I believe those are the midterms for the first trimester, which ends around mid-July. Keep in mind that Japanese education values midterm/final exam scores for all grades very highly, so it's natural that the students at Yamaku make a big deal out of them. Based on the 2007 calendar and other events shown in KS, my best estimate is that Yamaku's exam week falls on the week of July 16, after which there is a six-week summer break. I'm not 100% certain about that though. Looking at a real-life academic schedule for the 2012 year (calendar-wise, it's the same as 2007), I saw that same exam week falling on the week of July 9, the day before Hanako's birthday, and her route shows Hisao studying for the exams after all that. I haven't been able to find an equivalent schedule for 2007 proper, so any help there is appreciated.

As for the size of Yamaku itself, I don't know enough about Japanese high schools to really tell, aside from the information provided above.

Bad Apple wrote:What is the size of the Yamaku student body and just how expansive is the school property itself?

I don't believe it's stated how large the student body is.
But as for the size, well: Yamaku is based off of Brown University, specifically the Pembroke Campus.

The actual size I'm not too familiar with, but I believe it's a few city blocks (Providence-sized mind you) to a few acres. I'd say maybe 2-4 acres

Also:

ProfAllister wrote:We can thus estimate that the current student body is around 216 students, give or take.

Holy shit, my freshman CLASS was larger than that (by my senior year it dropped to 175 people from 250 Freshman year)
Japanese Highschools seem to be small, or at least Yamaku is

ProfAllister wrote:We kind of sort of have answers to both of those.

Excellent sir, excellent. The community offers its thanks for delivering so speedily.

I didn't expect the Yamaku student body to be so microscopic, even by the standards I was used to. That's astonishing.

ProfAllister wrote:If we use 3-3 as a basis, there are 18 seats per class.

On the interest of a more definite answer, however, I recall the VN stating the blind and deaf classes were stuffed with students, hence Shizune being in 3-3 (in addition to her being born deaf). This is anecdotal, but it may have been because those cases form the majority of Yamaku, but don't quote me on that. It's been forever since I've read KS.

So, in response to the above I ask: Is it possible that the average is higher than 3-3, and 3-3 is simply underpopulated? Would using the class size average in Japan (if there is one) lead to a much higher number? If not, then is Yamaku just exceptionally prestigious?

Bad Apple wrote:

ProfAllister wrote:We kind of sort of have answers to both of those.

Excellent sir, excellent. The community offers its thanks for delivering so speedily.

I didn't expect the Yamaku student body to be so microscopic, even by the standards I was used to. That's astonishing.

Well, keep in mind this is a school for disabled kids, one of at least a few. It's not going to be something people try to get into constantly and are declined. Comparing it to another high school / College would be silly.

When you start figuring out the numbers, looking at average might help, but it's nothing concrete.

I'm sure they'd want to keep the classrooms more or less equal in size, but at the same time there would have to be specialty classes like for the deaf and blind that couldn't integrate as well. The deaf or blind classes could be much higher or lower than the "average". It's entirely possible that there might be enough spill over to require multiple blind of deaf classes for a single year. It all depends on how many disabled people enrole that year.

I'd also think that on average the class you start with is more or less the class you graduate with. So if Miki and Molly are in the same class the first year, more likely than not they're going to be in class together the second and third year.

Then again, there is a turnover. You have to wonder exactly how serious Nurse was when he talked about not having any fatalities this year. It's kind of depressing, but the fact that the Yamaku yearbook might have at least one obituary per volume is a possibility. (Boy that sounds a lot more morbid that I meant it to.) Then of course there will be those that have to drop out because their condition takes a turn for the worse, or even those that recover enough to go to a normal school. I'd image there are a least a few students that go to Yamaku because they've broken their neck or their back or something equally serious so they need to wear some kind of cast or brace for most of the school year. Going to Yamaku while they heal might be seen as being better for them than going to a normal school. Taking that in mind, Mutou's class might have started much bigger the first year but by the third year he could have lost quite a few students to recover, worsening conditions, or fatalities.

Sea wrote: Well, keep in mind this is a school for disabled kids, one of at least a few. It's not going to be something people try to get into constantly and are declined. Comparing it to another high school / College would be silly.

It's not like disabilities are few and far in between. The definition of what constitutes a disability is widespread (see Social Security and other disability insurance) and is not limited to physical restrictions or lacking one of the senses (see Hanako's old scars). Besides, Yamaku also enrolls non-disabled students, remember?

I doubt Japan's percentage of disabled people merits the low student body count you're backing up, unless Yamaku, as a private school (it is a private school, right?), really is prestigious.

The only other alternative I can conjure is that legally, there is a much lower ratio of disabled people in Japan due to the associated stigma there. But I doubt that.

Oddball wrote:

Decent points.

Oddball wrote:Boy that sounds a lot more morbid that I meant it to.

Didn't Emi gave you a good piece of advice on this one? Those things happen. And there's hardly anything you can do to it. And if some poor fellow lived in Yamaku a bit longer than he would in normal school, having much better experience and understanding, then there's nothing bad in him dying in Yamaku. It could have been much worse. Well, there's a heavy emotional load on both staff and students, but that's the part of growing up - understanding that people die at the end, and learning to deal with it. Think of it as of lesson life gives you.

Aura wrote:

ewx wrote:From what I can gather:

Class 3-2 is the blind/partially-sighted class that Lilly and Kenji are in.
Class 3-3 has Hisao, Shizune, Misha, Hanako and all the minor characters like Miki.
Class 3-4 has Emi and Rin.

Is there a class 3-1? Is it mentioned anywhere in the story?

There is, but I don't think it's mentioned anywhere instory. 3-1 is a class for deaf students. All their lessons are in sign language. Shizune has elected to attend a "mixed" class.

I asked back in the Ask thread a few months back about these sorts of things. Apparently Shizune is in 3-3 by choice, not because 3-1 is full.
As for accepting disabled students, the only one we actually see is Misha and she is actively trying to learn sign language and whatnot to help disabled people in the future. From that, I'd hazard a guess that Yamaku only lets in non-disabled students if they have a valid reason for being there.

I don't think the low student population is due to high death rates or it being prestigious. If the death rates were high then then you'd think they would be significant enough to get a mention in the VN. It doesn't seem prestigious either, as Hisao seems to just waltz in (although that could be due to his aptitude in sciences etc.).

I remember once hearing that the student body was somewhere around 300 or so...definitely no higher.

Keep in mind that Japanese education values midterm/final exam scores for all grades very highly, so it's natural that the students at Yamaku make a big deal out of them.

Is that also true in the final year of high school though? From what I've heard, the final year in high school is pretty much entirely geared towards preparing for the National Center Test for University Admissions which is held in January and in case of many universities, their own entrance exams as well. Grades obtained at the school itself during the year don't really mean much other than as an indication if the student's well-prepared or not for the big tests ahead.

In one of the really super old threads, one of the devs said that the number was somewhere in the two hundreds. (I forget exactly where) but anywhere from 200 to 300 feels about right to me.

What I'm somewhat curious about is the other disabled school that they the competed against in Emi's track meet.