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Re: The United States of Misha Chapter Two Up 5/6

Posted: Thu May 10, 2012 2:23 pm
by Silentcook
Hoitash wrote:Remember:

<>=Japanese
<[]>=JSL
[]=ASL
[“”]= ASL with someone speaking what they’re signing
<[“”]>=…you get the idea
Too busy. Firstly, you shouldn't need to put up a "reminder" in the first place: conventions are best introduced in writing and then left for the reader to remember. This is a sign of things getting too complicated.

Secondly, you shouldn't have the last two conventions: too much stuff enclosing the sentences. I'm not even a fan of the double brackets used for JSL, but as previously mentioned, they could be inevitable. Remember, you will still want to use normal punctuation.

Thirdly, you're effectively already using <“”> <[“”]> [“”] because you're not dropping the “” that indicate speech. It all adds up.

Re: The United States of Misha Chapter Two Up 5/6

Posted: Thu May 10, 2012 2:52 pm
by Hoitash
Silentcook wrote: Too busy. Firstly, you shouldn't need to put up a "reminder" in the first place: conventions are best introduced in writing and then left for the reader to remember. This is a sign of things getting too complicated.

Secondly, you shouldn't have the last two conventions: too much stuff enclosing the sentences. I'm not even a fan of the double brackets used for JSL, but as previously mentioned, they could be inevitable. Remember, you will still want to use normal punctuation.

Thirdly, you're effectively already using <“”> <[“”]> [“”] because you're not dropping the “” that indicate speech. It all adds up.
Yeah, I just put the reminder because I'm anal like that. When you read it, is it self-evident? That's the real test, like you said.

Also, the situations where more then one of these occurring are pretty rare. And [""] is only if someone is simultaneously saying what they're signing, which only happens when a non-deaf person is talking to other non-deaf people, and is signing the conversation for the deaf person (the best example I have of this is, again, Weekend at Hisao's at the dinner party.)

I knew the language issue would be a challenge.

Re: The United States of Misha Updated 5/10

Posted: Thu May 10, 2012 3:50 pm
by Elcor
Great chapter, looking forward to reading more.

Re: The United States of Misha Chapter Two Up 5/6

Posted: Thu May 10, 2012 9:17 pm
by acewing905
Hoitash wrote:
Yeah, I just put the reminder because I'm anal like that. When you read it, is it self-evident? That's the real test, like you said.

Also, the situations where more then one of these occurring are pretty rare. And [""] is only if someone is simultaneously saying what they're signing, which only happens when a non-deaf person is talking to other non-deaf people, and is signing the conversation for the deaf person (the best example I have of this is, again, Weekend at Hisao's at the dinner party.)

I knew the language issue would be a challenge.
Umm... Just an idea, ignore if terrible, but what if you just used one format, like [] to indicate all sign language and just the regular format "" for speech irrespective of language? Leave the language to context, perhaps? Depending on who is speaking and who is being spoken to, wouldn't it be clear which language is used?
Anyway, looking forward to read more. Misha FTW. :D

Re: The United States of Misha Chapter Two Up 5/6

Posted: Thu May 10, 2012 9:59 pm
by Hoitash
Umm... Just an idea, ignore if terrible, but what if you just used one format, like [] to indicate all sign language and just the regular format "" for speech irrespective of language? Leave the language to context, perhaps? Depending on who is speaking and who is being spoken to, wouldn't it be clear which language is used?
Anyway, looking forward to read more. Misha FTW. :D
Huh... Might be worth a shot.

Re: The United States of Misha Updated 5/10

Posted: Thu May 10, 2012 10:23 pm
by Oddball
Personally, I'd much rather read, Misha said, Misha said in Japanese, Misha signed as she said, and stuff like that rather than trying to remember which symbol was which.

Re: The United States of Misha Updated 5/10

Posted: Thu May 10, 2012 10:55 pm
by Hoitash
Oddball wrote:Personally, I'd much rather read, Misha said, Misha said in Japanese, Misha signed as she said, and stuff like that rather than trying to remember which symbol was which.
Fair enough. I'm hoping it's self-evident enough the symbols aren't really needed. At this point I use them to help my writing as much as anything else.

EDIT: I'm ditching the symbols- except brackets- for the next chapter, and we'll see how it goes. I don't think it will be an issue, hopefully.

Re: The United States of Misha Updated 5/10

Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 9:45 am
by Hoitash
I honestly don’t know if 2008 webcam technology was good enough for sign language conversations.

Oops.

A few people have said I’m over thinking my language issue here, so I’m going to ditch the symbols in this chapter, and let me know how it works for you. I’m keeping brackets for sign language.

Enjoy having “One Week” stuck in your head now.


Previous Chapter


Chapter Four: It’s Been One Week, Since you Signed to Me



Orientation had gone better then Misha had expected; she had trouble in some places, but she had gotten the gist, and she made notes on things she wasn’t sure on to clear up before classes started.

Orientation and introduction seminars for her major’s took most of Friday and Saturday, but once again, on Saturday night she found herself awake and attempting to work her webcam.

“Are you gonna use your headphones?” Carla asked, the Risk board set out in front of her; the two had played a game to keep Misha awake.

Misha shook her head, “it’s okay, Cacchan, I won’t make too much noise.”

Carla shrugged and grabbed her copy of Twilight to read. Misha took a long look at a framed photo leaning on one of the desk’s shelves. It showed Misha, Shizune, and Hisao posing for the camera in their green and white Yamaku uniforms, their right hands held high.

All for one, and one for all. Sighing lightly, Misha finished getting ready and waited.

After a few seconds a screen popped up, containing a young woman with black hair, deep blue eyes, and black half-frame glasses. Her hair was growing out a bit, tied back in a short ponytail. When she saw Misha’s face, Shizune smiled widely.

[Can you see me all right?] Shizune asked. Understanding her meaning, Misha nodded.

[Yes, I can understand you. Just please don’t get too angry or go too fast; you might cause lag.]

Shizune smiled, [Okay. Hisao emailed me and said you were doing well. So, what are the Americans like?]

Misha smiled, [So far, they’re fine. I haven’t been mugged or anything, and everyone’s been friendly, when I talk to them. With big cities like this people really don’t talk to each other, unless they know each other. I’ve been so busy these last two days I haven’t even really spoken with my roommate.]

[Roommate? What’s she like?]

[She’s nice, and she likes to play Risk… Hey, could the four of us arrange a game via these webcams?]

[I don’t see why not], Shizune said, the competitive glint entering her eyes, [I’d love a new opponent to challenge.]

Misha turned to Carla, who had noticed the conversation and had become enraptured by the various gestures and movements, “Cachan, would you be willing to play Risk over the internet sometime~ with my friends from Japan?”

Carla shrugged, “sure, although there are computer programs for that, you know.”

Misha shook her head, “Hicchan doesn’t like using those; he says the computer’s random number gener-ator is just as bad as luck. Even though luck is~ a skill.”

A tapping coming from her screen made her turn back to Shizune, who was tapping a pen onto her desk, [Sorry, Shicchan; Cacchan said she’d like to try it sometimes, though there are computer programs for that kind of thing.]

Shizune shook her head, [Hisao hates those.]

[I told her that, though I need to explain who he is at some point. I don’t think I’ve mentioned you two yet. But enough about me, how are you?]

[I’m fine, nothing much going on here, though the students at this university are terrible at board games; it’s no fun if I win so easily all the time.]

Misha waggled a finger at Shizune for a moment, [Play nice with the other kids, Shicchan.]

Shizune frowned, the competitive glint back, [I’m trying, but they’re so terrible, it’s embarrassing. Their poor skill reflects poorly on my chosen school. Its honor must be upheld!]

Shizune smiled to show she was kidding, causing Misha to laugh loudly. Carla jumped with a start and fell out of her bed onto the floor.

“Sorry, Carla,” Misha said before finishing her conversation with Shizune some time later. Ending the call, she turned to Carla, who had given up reading to watch Misha sign over the webcam.

“Uh, what was that?” Carla asked.

“My best friend is deaf, so we converse through sign language~!”

Carla nodded, “oh, cool. Uh, who’s Hicchan?”

“Oh, Hisao Nakai, he’s my other friend, and Shicchan’s- er, Shizune’s, the friend I was just signing with- boyfriend.”

“Oh,” Carla said, and didn’t pursue the conversation, instead putting away her book and the Risk game to surf the internet on her laptop for a few hours. When the only light in the room was Carla’s screen’s glow, Misha was able to easily fall asleep.

==

Sunday and Monday- being a holiday- passed relatively quickly, and Tuesday morning found Misha in her first class of the week, an introductory course to her Communication major.

The class was a decent size, with light blue walls, and Misha sat in one of the middle rows. The room curved slightly, and the rows of chairs and desks followed that curve. Misha had arrived five or ten minutes early, and took the time to examine her other students, her curiosity piquing as they trickled into class. None of them stuck out to her in any real way. She wasn’t sure if she wanted to talk to any of them, and opted for looking at her notebook until the professor arrived, her hand nervously twirling her pen as she did so.

The professor strode in a few minutes before class started. A middle aged-man with black hair, he wore a gray button down shirt and matching pants. He plopped his briefcase on a table near the lecture podium and started shuffling through papers. Remembering he was one of the one’s who had emailed a syllabus, Misha quickly started scanning it as it sat next to her notebook.

“Well, by my watch it’s time to start,” the professor said, his voice piercing the student’s muttering quickly, “this is Intro to Communication Science and Disorders, and I’m Professor Jones. And no, I was not on a show with a robot.”

A few students chuckled at the apparent joke, and the professor continued, going over the syllabus in detail. Misha didn’t have too much trouble following through, though the thought of so much reading in preparation for exams made her nervous.

Since going through the syllabus had taken a while, Professor Jones dismissed the class early, stating there wasn’t a point to start a lecture on the first day. The class shuffled out, and Misha wondered where she’d get lunch before her afternoon class.

She didn’t get far before running into a familiar face.

“Henry?” Misha asked when she saw him walking towards her. He smiled and waved, and she returned the gesture.

“Don’t worry, I’m not stalking you,” he said, stopping a few feet in front of her and slipping into her language so he’d be sure she’d understand, “I just felt like I should see how your first class went, and maybe help you pick a lunch spot. Don’t worry, I’m this involved with all my mentees.”

“Thanks, that’d be great,” Misha didn’t like being alone on campus too much; it reminded her too much of Yamaku when she had almost abandoned Shizune and Hisao. As the two made their way outside they passed a bulletin board, and one of the flyers caught Misha’s attention.

Stopping dead in her tracks, she eyed the flyer as if it was a sacred relic:

LGBTQ Events for the Month!
Lesbian/Gay/Bisexual/Transgender/Queer

Come on by for our first meeting of the semester! Make new friends!


Misha lifted her right hand to the flyer, tracing the large, black capital letters printed on it.

“You okay?” Henry asked, after noticing she wasn’t walking anymore.

Misha didn’t answer, instead rolling her backpack off her back and pulling out a pen and notebook. Carefully, she rewrote the entire flyer in bright pink ink. It was only when she re-shouldered her bag did she notice Henry’s face; the face of a man unsure of how to ask what he wanted to ask.

“Uh, we should go, don’t you think~?” Misha asked.

“Reading the LGBT flyer?” he asked, apparently deciding to take the direct approach.

Misha froze, unsure of how to answer. She wasn’t ashamed of herself, and this group sounded like a great way to deal with her questions; she hadn’t really thought much about her sexual orientation, and looking into that facet of her life was important in order for her to sort herself out. Before she could say anything Henry spoke again, using Japanese in an attempt to help calm her, “it’s not my business, it’s just they list that stuff online, too.”

Misha’s shoulders slackened as she relaxed, “okay. And thanks.”

Henry shook his head, “don’t thank me for you being yourself. Like I said, it’s not my business. So, on to lunch?”

Misha took another look at the flyer before nodding and leaving the building with Henry.

+++

Next Chapter

Well, I entered a political shitstorm.

I will do my utmost to handle this matter as tactfully and respectfully as I can, and I apologize profusely if anyone takes offense to anything I write. Unfortunately, I’m too sober to be an inconsiderate jackass right now. Where’s my tequila…

Re: The United States of Misha Updated 5/13

Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 10:03 am
by acewing905
I spotted one tiny problem. The nickname "cachan" is too similar to "kachan", a term used to call one's mother in a friendly manner by some Japanese people.
Overall good chapter. :) It'll be interesting to see if Misha joins the LGBT thing. But I'd feel that she won't have the courage to do that so quickly.

Re: The United States of Misha Updated 5/13

Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 10:17 am
by Hoitash
acewing905 wrote:I spotted one tiny problem. The nickname "cachan" is too similar to "kachan", a term used to call one's mother in a friendly manner by some Japanese people.
Overall good chapter. :) It'll be interesting to see if Misha joins the LGBT thing. But I'd feel that she won't have the courage to do that so quickly.
I have a lead-up to the meeting that should help, but you're right, she's definitely at a point where she's doing things that help because she knows she has to, not necessarily because she wants to.

That nickname, considering what happens later, is even more pertinent now :)

Re: The United States of Misha Updated 5/13

Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 10:49 am
by Mirage_GSM
acewing905 wrote:I spotted one tiny problem. The nickname "cachan" is too similar to "kachan", a term used to call one's mother in a friendly manner by some...
Actually, that's not a problem at all, because kaa-chan is pronounced with a long vowel, while Misha usually creates her nicknames using double consonants (cacchan). No Japanese would confuse the two.

Oh, and because of that chapter title I can't get that song about the KKK beating up gay jewish black dudes out of my head... (Come to think of it, I don't even know the original...)

Re: The United States of Misha Updated 5/13

Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 10:52 am
by acewing905
Mirage_GSM wrote:
acewing905 wrote:I spotted one tiny problem. The nickname "cachan" is too similar to "kachan", a term used to call one's mother in a friendly manner by some...
Actually, that's not a problem at all, because kaa-chan is pronounced with a long vowel, while Misha usually creates her nicknames using double consonants (cacchan). No Japanese would confuse the two.
Oh, yeah. You're right. I read "cachan" as kaachan when I read the story, leading to my comment. I totally forgot that she'd makes names like Hicchan and Shicchan.

Re: The United States of Misha Updated 5/13

Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 11:06 am
by Hoitash
acewing905 wrote:
Mirage_GSM wrote:
acewing905 wrote:I spotted one tiny problem. The nickname "cachan" is too similar to "kachan", a term used to call one's mother in a friendly manner by some...
Actually, that's not a problem at all, because kaa-chan is pronounced with a long vowel, while Misha usually creates her nicknames using double consonants (cacchan). No Japanese would confuse the two.
Oh, yeah. You're right. I read "cachan" as kaachan when I read the story, leading to my comment. I totally forgot that she'd makes names like Hicchan and Shicchan.
Edited to reflect this.

Pardon my ignorance, but what is the benefit of the double consonant? Or is it just one of those language quirks non-speaker's don't understand? Or is it done to prevent possible confusion with actual words?

Re: The United States of Misha Updated 5/13

Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 6:18 pm
by Mirage_GSM
German has something similar, but it's a bit hard to explain in english...
The closest I can think of right now is the double consonant you sometimes get when constructing a gerund, like "shipping" for example, only with a very short, abrupt pause after the "p"...

Re: The United States of Misha Updated 5/13

Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 10:55 pm
by Hoitash
Okay, that makes sense. Thanks for the info :)