Katawa Shoujo Forums

-

These forums are perfect for venting your thoughts. We've heard a good number of life stories here and are happy to hear more.

These forums really are great. Everyone from random 4channers to college professors are here.

... Maybe there is some feminist conspiracy to reduce the chauvinistic forces...

it helps to view the situation from another angle. if you had an obvious problem- would you want your potential love interest probing you nonstop about it? or would you rather just accept you as you are and enjoy your company?

encrypted12345 wrote:... Maybe there is some feminist conspiracy to reduce the chauvinistic forces...

Or perhaps it's not so much a conspiracy against man from the women as a last pleading attempt from women to open the eyes of man?

To tell men that what they need arn't knights in shining armor who rush in to save them and bless them with fleeting romance but a soul who will be there for them forever and always through good and bad and will never see them for anyone or anything else other than what they are?

My eyes were also opened by this, I came to the realisation that as a man I was programmed to ,quote, "Protect Girls and Women",unquote. That try as I might to see good in my ways I might have done far more harm than good to those around me and close to me with my actions, my high-and-mighty preconceptions of what women were to men.

I know your feelings resign102, I feel them well. It is something of a hammer hit to the soul to realise that much of what you had done that was thought good by you was infact quite damaging to those on the recieving end. This self-disgust, This self-loathing is all to real and some might say well deserved as reperation for our inane need to feel like a protector and refuse to see things from others point of view.

All that can be done is to know that now we understand and that we must move forward. Our apology to those we hurt is the resolution to never again make the same mistake and think ourselves mightier than those we love.

Ours is not the moral high ground, but the starting point of growth.

This is what life is for. Realising that we've made mistakes, we've done stupid things in the past, but learning from them so that we don't do stupid things in the future.

I'm relatively sure that there're worse things that've been done to women by men than holding them up on a silver platter. The important thing is that you realised you were doing it, and realised that you didn't want to do it anymore.


In commiseration with you, I've got to admit that I fall down pretty heavily on the side of chivalry, and white knighting, partly also exaggerated by my personality of wanting to help people in general, not just potential romantic partners. The difference is that I was lucky(?) enough to have a feminist friend (FEMINIST CONSPIRACY!!!), who pulled me up rather quickly when I first met her, and made me realise what I was doing.
I still struggle between white knighting and not. While playing the Hanako route for example, I had a massive urge to protect her from all her problems, but at the same time I knew that she needed to learn to fight her daemons herself, so I managed to get the good ending first time.

Resign102 wrote:I mean that whenever I am alone, I wind up staring at the wall pleading for a rewind button for life.

I don't know you at all obviously, but... *offers hug*.

There isn't a rewind button. You know it, I know it - we all do. But there is a proverbial play button. I know this is cliche, shitty advice coming from some random chick on the internet. But honestly, you may not be able to change what has happened, but you can do things differently now and in the future. "Now" is a particularly important time to focus on. I wish there was something more solid and profound I could offer you, but there isn't at the moment. I think making the apologies you mentioned would be a very important step - for you and for those people. After that, perhaps you will feel more free to move forward.

It can be irksome and frustrating when people are always trying to save you. For me, I grew up very much depending on myself for survival. When I got older, it was frustrating to encounter people constantly trying to "help" me - even in truly healthy ways (like the way friends help each other out, for instance). It was insulting and often came across as demeaning. But hey.. everyone needs a bit of saving now and then. I suppose the point is to realize that while everyone needs support occasionally, it isn't something that we (as humans) need other people to constantly provide to us. It becomes patronizing, hurtful, and damaging. Sometimes you just have to do things on your own in order to grow. Women aren't so different from men at the end of the day and at the end of the day, these things vary on an individual basis and not on the basis of gender. Women, as a group, aren't as delicate as some people think we are.. and hey - you know that now. And like I said before, *now* is what is important. There is room for all of us to be better people.

I hope my reply hasn't upset you further. I truly wish you the best. We all have moments of self-loathing. And we all have the ability to grow as a result of those moments.

-

Good, white knights are lame and usually fail. I know from experience.

First girlfriend, white knight complex, 2 years of miserably destructive co-dependance. Fast forward to present day. More honesty, 8 years of relationship and 4 of marriage. We don't even hate each other yet!

Thrasher Thetic wrote:Good, white knights are lame and usually fail. I know from experience.

First girlfriend, white knight complex, 2 years of miserably destructive co-dependance. Fast forward to present day. More honesty, 8 years of relationship and 4 of marriage. We don't even hate each other yet!

^ Brotastic hero this man is!

-

Resign102 wrote:

Thrasher Thetic wrote:Good, white knights are lame and usually fail. I know from experience.

First girlfriend, white knight complex, 2 years of miserably destructive co-dependance. Fast forward to present day. More honesty, 8 years of relationship and 4 of marriage. We don't even hate each other yet!

Ha, I suppose it would have helped if the first girl I was with wasn't completely reliant and sheltered. I still liked her, but I guess it started me off on the wrong track.

May well be. We are all products of our experiences and environments. This is why I was so shocked when people were treating me like I couldn't tie my own shoelaces. xP Early experiences taught me that people were unhelpful and undependable, let alone capable of being overly so.

-

Well I was referring to this here:

"For me, I grew up very much depending on myself for survival. When I got older, it was frustrating to encounter people constantly trying to "help" me - even in truly healthy ways (like the way friends help each other out, for instance). It was insulting and often came across as demeaning."

The fact that I was bothered by even normative/healthy offers of assistance was a product of my past experiences. That's all I was trying to say, sorry if it wasn't clear.

Resign102 wrote:Furthermore, I still have Rin and Lilly's route to finish, and frankly I dont think I can. The sudden epiphany Shizune and Hanako's routes gave me has left me feeling sick and depressed. I don't mean "the feels" that everyone keeps talking about. I mean that whenever I am alone, I wind up staring at the wall pleading for a rewind button for life. It's not emotional attachment (although Shizune's route was very heartwarming), its self-disgust.

Mistake. Play it through. You'll feel better in the end.

-