Katawa Shoujo Forums

Xanatos wrote:

YZQ wrote:

Guest Poster wrote:Lilly didn't look completely sober herself either. Heck, that wine was probably hers to begin with.

The wine is definitely hers, and yes, Lily drank a little herself. But, looks like Hanako's the one going wild.

The art work is done by one of the official artists, but it's not canon. Hisao managed to tuck Hanako in bed before it got to the stage depicted in the art.

Misread "tuck" as...Well, you know.

Come to think about it, maybe Hisao should have went with the "f" instead of the "t". Very likely, after Hanako wakes up, she goes "Hey, a guy actually took advantage of me. I am wanted!" Sure beats the unenjoyable one they had later.

YZQ wrote:Gotta love the Oedipus complex. Freud would be proud.

I'm not 100% sure any more (been ages) but I think for girls it's called Electra complex. If this is a "The more you know", someone gif it please.

Come to think about it, maybe Hisao should have went with the "f" instead of the "t". Very likely, after Hanako wakes up, she goes "Hey, a guy actually took advantage of me. I am wanted!" Sure beats the unenjoyable one they had later.

That certainly would have solved the "Did Hisao rape Hanako"-debate one hell of a lot sooner.

Carighan wrote:

YZQ wrote:Gotta love the Oedipus complex. Freud would be proud.

I'm not 100% sure any more (been ages) but I think for girls it's called Electra complex. If this is a "The more you know", someone gif it please.

I quote Wiki: Sigmund Freud, who coined the term "Oedipus complex" believed that the Oedipus complex is a desire for the mother in both sexes (he believed that girls have a homosexual attraction towards their mother). "Electra complex" was coined by Jung, whom Freud had a massive feud with once their ideas split.

Guest Poster wrote:

Come to think about it, maybe Hisao should have went with the "f" instead of the "t". Very likely, after Hanako wakes up, she goes "Hey, a guy actually took advantage of me. I am wanted!" Sure beats the unenjoyable one they had later.

That certainly would have solved the "Did Hisao rape Hanako"-debate one hell of a lot sooner.

At the very least, Hanako should have tried to secure some alcohol for herself and Hisao. She deserved better for her first time.

At the very least, Hanako should have tried to secure some alcohol for herself and Hisao. She deserved better for her first time.

Yes, because Hanako is totally not the kind of girl who might think thoughts like "He only wanted me because he had alcohol." afterwards. At least now she had the knowledge that Hisao truly was attracted to her and that it wasn't the alcohol that drove him to sleep with her.

There are plenty of girls whose first time didn't exactly feel good. Hanako is hardly unique in this.

Guest Poster wrote:

At the very least, Hanako should have tried to secure some alcohol for herself and Hisao. She deserved better for her first time.

Yes, because Hanako is totally not the kind of girl who might think thoughts like "He only wanted me because he had alcohol." afterwards. At least now she had the knowledge that Hisao truly was attracted to her and that it wasn't the alcohol that drove him to sleep with her.

There are plenty of girls whose first time didn't exactly feel good. Hanako is hardly unique in this.

A bit awkward, but I was thinking more of "Ok. We want to have sex. But, we could really do with something to relieve the tension." Cue the alcohol. Making good stuff better.

YZQ wrote:

Guest Poster wrote:

YZQ wrote:At the very least, Hanako should have tried to secure some alcohol for herself and Hisao. She deserved better for her first time.

Yes, because Hanako is totally not the kind of girl who might think thoughts like "He only wanted me because he had alcohol." afterwards. At least now she had the knowledge that Hisao truly was attracted to her and that it wasn't the alcohol that drove him to sleep with her.

There are plenty of girls whose first time didn't exactly feel good. Hanako is hardly unique in this.

A bit awkward, but I was thinking more of "Ok. We want to have sex. But, we could really do with something to relieve the tension." Cue the alcohol.

Sex while boozed up, may not be very smart.
And Guest Poster has a point, Hanako doesn't seem to be very physically active for the most part, so unlike possibly Emi (girls who are physically active often tear their hymen), hers most likely would have been intact at that point. That and her scarring would kind of make her less... flexible. (I think the only girl who is specifically mentioned during the VN to have her hymen broken was Lilly during her first H-Scene)

Well, I'm not suggesting alcohol to the point of choking on vomit. Just a bit to loosen up. Also, Lord knows that Hanako becomes another person with the right amount of alcohol.

YZQ wrote:Well, I'm not suggesting alcohol to the point of choking on vomit. Just a bit to loosen up. Also, Lord knows that Hanako becomes another person with the right amount of alcohol.

In Vino Veritas. not really.

She loses her shyness, which is very important. Even her Bad End is a nod that for her to move on, she must lose at least some of her shyness.

Hisao notes during the party that the wine had the tendency to suddenly hit Hanako at once, meaning it'd be easy to go too far too quickly. Yes, Hanako becomes another person with the right amount of alcohol, but alcohol doesn't merely remove inhibitions, but it also can alter behavior. Hisao already felt bad when he learned Hanako merely had sex with him because she was afraid she'd lose him. I don't think he'd sleep with Hanako if the latter got boozed up again. The amount she got at her party moved her way beyond the point where she could have given actual consent and Hisao isn't the kind of person to go ahead and assume he'll get consent after the fact. It's the consent deal that makes me feel like alcohol during their first time would have made things very questionable. Despite being uncomfortable, Hanako gave Hisao consent at various stages. Under the influence of alcohol, those small gestures of consent would have meant nothing.

Yes, Hanako is shy but she'll need to overcome that shyness by placing her trust in other people, not by getting hammered. Yes, that first time was rather uncomfortable for Hanako, but at least she got some emotional fulfillment out of it which I think is still important enough to skip the bottle. People who have their first time while intoxicated tend to regret it later.

I'll say "Place trust in yourself". When you don't even trust yourself (as how I see Hanako), you can forget about trusting others.

YZQ wrote:I'll say "Place trust in yourself". When you don't even trust yourself (as how I see Hanako), you can forget about trusting others.

She hates herself, there's a difference between heating yourself and not trusting yourself.

Steinherz wrote:

YZQ wrote:I'll say "Place trust in yourself". When you don't even trust yourself (as how I see Hanako), you can forget about trusting others.

She hates herself, there's a difference between heating yourself and not trusting yourself.

If you hate yourself, how can you trust yourself? Goes into new territory when logically, she has no reason to hate herself. She didn't start the fire, for one. "Fear is the mind-killer", indeed.

Goes into new territory when logically, she has no reason to hate herself. She didn't start the fire, for one.

Logic plays no part in this.

Hanako's fears and problems aren't very logical, but it's hard for her to say "it's not my fault you don't like me," when everybody else can't even stand to look a her.