Katawa Shoujo Forums

Well, after deciding to read this in between more important priorities a month or two ago, I've finally finished. (and I read the comments, too!)

It obviously lacks the immediacy of your shorter works, but that's to be expected in long-form works.

My biggest complaint is perhaps more a failing on my own part than that of your writing. I'm detail oriented, and a stickler for a certain degree of accuracy (and internal consistency). I'm not nearly as obsessed as James Joyce reportedly was, but a big enough inaccuracy can really hurt my absorption into a story. This hits me on two pretty major points:

As already noted, Suzu suffers from Hollywood narcolepsy. While much of what happens in the story is similar to what can happen with narcolepsy, it doesn't quite fit. It could work if Suzu suffered from some extremely severe form of narcolepsy and was completely unmedicated, but that opens up FAR more plot holes than it closes. It fits in well with the drama, but as far as immersion goes, Suzu's narcolepsy feels too much like a magical mystery disease.

Shakespeare. Now, I love me some Shakespeare, but it's pretty hard to argue that it doesn't lose something when translated from the original Klingon. Shakespeare is remembered for his meter, his wordcraft, and his wit. For the most part, the stories themselves are kind of terrible. When being shifted to another language, meter, wordcraft, and wit all depend on the talent of the translator. Given that Hisao only had four months to read a relatively limited library in a hospital, I feel it's a bridge too far for him to have read and liked a translation of a massive collection of works that are unquestionably best read in the original language.

I've noticed a few people complaining about something else that bothered me. Suzu is constantly dwelling on her problems. This is realistic, believable, and annoying as all get-out. In the game, they made sure to avoid that with a simple mechanism: anything that got Hisao to dwell too much on his heart issues leads pretty much directly to the Manly Picnic. It is likely a fair representation of any internal monologue that Suzu, or any of the canon girls, would have. And most of the canon stories do dwell on the girls' issues just as much. But there's a different tone when you're on the outside. In the hypothetical Hisao viewpoint, the reader is wondering what's bugging Suzu. Slowly, you start getting a sense of who she is, and her actions start to make sense. But from the perspective we have, it's far too easy to get fed up with Suzu, ready to shout, "We get it! You have brother issues! Get over yourself already!"

Alternately, it could be that it seems like that's the only thing that's on her mind, ever.

Hisao's so wonderful. It's nice going on a date with him. I'm starting to think I may have to tell him about... the incident.

As I try to decide what to eat for breakfast, I'm brought to tears by a sudden memory. Seiji loved bagels.

With a delicate touch, Hisao gently massages my breasts, occasionally flicking my nipples. I moan in pleasure, but my heart isn't in it. I know that this is just another ploy to get me to think about my future.

It may be fair to say that she thinks way too much about the stuff she doesn't want to think about. Compare it to Hisao's heart condition. With a few exceptions, Hisao doesn't really put any thought to it (often to his detriment) until it jumps in rudely and screams "Hey! Remember me?" Of course,t hat may just be a more specific version of the admonition to show, don't tell.

Finally, a bit of your story suffers through no fault of your own. Having played Valkyrie Profile 2, I have a strong familiarity with Lezard's voice and facial expressions. It makes it hard to take scenes with him seriously.

All jokes and fun aside, this is a solid, well-written story. It's quite an accomplishment, both in size and scope. It's not perfect, and there are certainly areas where it can be tweaked and tightened, but it's still very good. Hopefully my comments make sense, despite their general scatterbrainedness.

That is a pretty excellent analysis, Prof. I find myself agreeing with a lot of it.

In my case, I do suppose my only personal complaint with the story is that it seems to have already hit its crescendo, its climax, the point where Suzu probably should finally come to terms with her problems, at least in a literary context. Granted, that's the way it went in the VN's routes - there's a fundamental bias for me there, so that complaint may be petty. This fic has been subverting some of the elements typical of route fanfics, something which is interesting and praiseworthy in its own right.

Realistically speaking, Suzu's problems wouldn't just magically fade away, but their persistence in this story leaves no end in sight for me. Or maybe I'm overlooking important details that are blinding me to the obvious. I suppose that's possible too. :p

Been a while since I've posted, but I do keep up.

Mirage_GSM wrote:And then... Why do you have to keep having her regress into depression all the time? I thought that problem had been resolved after the holidays. It's like the story is going in circles again and again...

Take it from a formerly depressed, now apathetic person. Habits are hard to break once formed. It takes a major shift in values, desires, and/or thinking to get over depression. I'm very much against meds as they don't actually deal with the problem most of the time.

As for the second part coming to terms with her brother's death is different than dealing with the trauma of how and where he died. It's like getting over the fact that a loved one died, but still fearing the cause. If he died from passing out at the subway station instead she may have developed an irrational fear of trains for example.

Courage isn't caused by the absence of fear, but doing while afraid.


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ProfAllister wrote:
1)I've noticed a few people complaining about something else that bothered me. Suzu is constantly dwelling on her problems. This is realistic, believable, and annoying as all get-out. In the game, they made sure to avoid that with a simple mechanism: anything that got Hisao to dwell too much on his heart issues leads pretty much directly to the Manly Picnic. It is likely a fair representation of any internal monologue that Suzu, or any of the canon girls, would have. And most of the canon stories do dwell on the girls' issues just as much. But there's a different tone when you're on the outside. In the hypothetical Hisao viewpoint, the reader is wondering what's bugging Suzu. Slowly, you start getting a sense of who she is, and her actions start to make sense. But from the perspective we have, it's far too easy to get fed up with Suzu, ready to shout, "We get it! You have brother issues! Get over yourself already!"

2)Alternately, it could be that it seems like that's the only thing that's on her mind, ever. ....
It may be fair to say that she thinks way too much about the stuff she doesn't want to think about. Compare it to Hisao's heart condition. With a few exceptions, Hisao doesn't really put any thought to it (often to his detriment) until it jumps in rudely and screams "Hey! Remember me?" Of course,t hat may just be a more specific version of the admonition to show, don't tell.

3)Finally, a bit of your story suffers through no fault of your own. Having played Valkyrie Profile 2, I have a strong familiarity with Lezard's voice and facial expressions. It makes it hard to take scenes with him seriously.

1)Funny that you say her brooding is "realistic, believable, and annoying as all get-out." and you're sick of it. From my brooding experiences and dealing with people who are also prone to brooding(people crying over loved ones for years.), I think it's pretty normal. It's only been a year and she's blamed herself for it most of that time. Hell, I brooded over getting disowned longer than that. I personally can only take Suzu as it is, because to shorten her brooding would cheapen the story.

Kind of like Edge in Star Ocean 4. He got over his depression of blowing up a whole planet oddly fast, which cheapened any emotional content that could have been had. It didn't help that he did it in the worst way possible either.

2) Depressed people think about negative things all the time. Just the nature of the beast. Seems to me she used Hisao as a focus so that she can forget her problems and fears. Doesn't seem to be working so well as Hisao is dragging her though her problems. At any rate, I get ya. The problem is she is caused trouble from her disorder much more than Hisao, atleast daily in fact story wise. Kind of hard to NOT think about it all the time with her 'Hollywood' extreme case.

Perhaps it'd be a good time for a Mr. Nurse visit and even Suzu out a bit. So episodes are less than every few hours. Morning, afternoon, evening, night. She's probably slept more than was conscious for classes.

3)As another VP2 player, I know what ya mean. I've generally just regarded Lezard as a person who shares names, and nothing more. Well, Unless Lezard does something crazy left field like use Kenji to separate Hisao and Suzu, then orchestrate some kind kidnapping/brainwashing and possible murder plot lol. That'd make a mess of the story tho, so it's fine that Lezard is less.. insane.

Man, I wish Tri-ace would re-release their stuff on the PSN network. My PS2 isn't working so good anymore lol.

Funny you should mention Edge.
Yes, he does fall into depression and for good reason, too. I won't spoiler the storyline here, but it's not because he suffers from a clinical condition and fell asleep through no fault of his own. He made a decision against the advice of some friends and something terrible hapens as a result.
Yes, he recovers from it as well, and again for good reson: There are people who rely on him and need him, who love him and help him and many more people would suffer if he continued to sulk - but there is another reason as well: A work of fiction has a storyline, and a conflict has to be resolved within this storyline or not resolved at all. Otherwise you keep dragging out a story that has long since run it's course.
In this story there are whole chapters where I have the feeling that I have read that exact thing before, just from a slightly different angle.
This career survey shouldn't be a plot point for... how many chapters has it been now since it was first mentioned? Because frankly, it really isn't that big of a deal. If she just sat down, filled in "Astronaut" and turned it in, nobody would bother her about it anymore. In fact, I'm surprised everyone is still bothering her about it. When I was in school a 50% return rate for such a thing would have probably been considered a success.
Another problem is that in the current chapter I had no idea what exactly she was ancious about: Hisao persuaded her to take the test and shows her the application form. She reads about the school and goes catatonic. Why? What could be so terrrible about a specific school? I thought it was planning for her future in general she is ancious about... Could it be that her brother told her he wanted to go to that school later? Could the name for the school share a kanji with her brother's name? I read on, formulating increasingly fantastic theroies, and then the big revelation: The school is in the city. And cities have hard asphalt.
By that time I really wanted to headdesk. Now she's afraid of cities in general? Concratulations, you just created neuroses enough to write many, many more chapters about...
As much as I like and admire your writing style, I'm not sure I really want to read about that, though.

Mirage_GSM wrote:Why? What could be so terrrible about a specific school? I thought it was planning for her future in general she is ancious about... Could it be that her brother told her he wanted to go to that school later? Could the name for the school share a kanji with her brother's name? I read on, formulating increasingly fantastic theroies, and then the big revelation: The school is in the city. And cities have hard asphalt.
By that time I really wanted to headdesk. Now she's afraid of cities in general? Congratulations, you just created neuroses enough to write many, many more chapters about...
As much as I like and admire your writing style, I'm not sure I really want to read about that, though.

I was expecting the same thing. Was I mistaken in remembering something to do with Seiji and a certain school? I don't remember whether any such thing was mentioned. In any case, the revelation that it was just because it was in the city was rather disappointing. I don't want to be the guy who says it, but I feel like this is heading down a Naruto path, wherein more and more content is released but the plot doesn't get anywhere for it. Just pages and pages of filler. I know it puts undue pressure on you, Scissorlips, and you are by no means obligated to cater to the whims of the readership, but perhaps you know, chugging things along a bit, would be pertinent.

When she went blank after reading the school's name and address, I thought it was the same school where her parents had sent her for some kind of college prep and she fell asleep. I figured she was scared because she didn't want to go back and risk another complete failure. Finding out that she's scared to even be in the same city where Seiji died is a bit much, I have to agree. Granted, people with severe depression tend to act a bit irrationally, but it's still kinda hard to believe. I also agree that having the career survey be a plot point that important that many times is rather odd.

Despite my grievances, I have to say that Scissorlips has done a pretty good job at getting the reader into Suzu's mindset. While her constant dwelling on the same issues has gotten a bit old from a narrative standpoint, I at least understand why she can't get them out of her head, and I have yet to think any of her actions or narration seemed at all out of character.

I think the only reason the survey became a major thing Mirage, is because 'the future' is a major thing in the game. Granted I think Scissorlips is trying to tie up too many loose ends on things that will take a really long time to work out. I think it would do him better to work solely on her attitude/mindset changing so that the reader has the hope that she will "work towards wanting to resolve issues instead of run from them for a brighter future."

He's going on pretty long though, and considering track record, this latest choice to chapter probably is leading to a bad/neutral end with a couple ways of that potentially happening.

Only thing that I feel is missing is creative solutions like doing college online and becoming a ghost writer, novelist, e-zine writer, blogger, online wholesaler, etc. She could also just take business courses online and go with the family business. There's lots of people that do these types of things to simply dodge issues while surviving post high school.

Wow, this thread...

Due to situational bias, I can't really participate in the discussion anymore, but I'll leave you with this helpful chart:

Very true meadows lol. Anything not stated by the writer of a fictional work, is debatable opinion. It's the only arena for division. Only irrational people debate facts.

Just don't go thinking we're raving madmen or anything. It's more like talking about a new episode of a show with other fans, every time a new chapter comes up. The speculations, the opinions all just show it's rather popular. If there was no discussion, then it would mean the work isn't popular among a varied spectrum of people.

It's like the show "Big Bang Theory." People get different things out of it based on personal experience and knowledge.

Sev'risk'avina wrote:H'okay, so, the timing of this is perfect for me. I'll start with my response to the newest post (eeeee!) then do a little catch up.

I'm very happy Kenji and Shizune (Mutou too I guess) are popping back up in the story, makes it feel like this is a part (a pseudo-part if you will) of the VN. Since Hisao never really escapes from Misha and Shizune, and considers them friends in a few of the lines (more on that later). And Kenji is Kenji. Don't think I could handle him myself, but he's a great character. Lots of humor potential, even if he is hitting the sauce pretty hard.... maybe even more so.

As to Mirages' words on Suzu slipping into depression, while I have never lost a sibling like that (I have two) one of my childhood friends took his own life a few years back. Every now and then when I find myself doing an activity he particularly liked and I get a little morose. Magic the Gathering is basically ruined for me, so I can extrapolate that kind of feeling to a sibling with out too much effort.

Okay, soap box time. In my last rant I left off with some details regarding my living situation etc. Turns out I got moved in a day late, but fine. In a pretty bang up apartment now, going to university. Or rather I was, for all of one day, before thanksgiving break hit. So I finished the VN (here is the more, the later is now!) more or less. 95% done, but I don't really have the heart to go back and do Rins' other endings. Her story is probably my third favorite now, still behind the Shizune(VN and alpha)/Suzu(this thing right hur) tie. So, yeah, soap box over.

Hope things are going well with your classes. I'm always happy to see an update round these parts, but it obviously has to take a back seat to the real world. So don't burn yourself out going too far one way or another, eh. Some of us users might just find you and lock ya in Shizunes' dungeon till ya finish this if ya do.

No poetry this time, but perhaps a shameless plug for a band I like. I usually can listen to this either when I'm upbeat or feeling down, so it's kind of dynamic. At least for me.

So Long Sentiment - Celldweller
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rszEi81v6Ts

Nice to see you drop by again. As for the characters, I think you're right, it's very nice to be returning to Yamaku and to have access to a wider cast.

As far as the "depression" goes, that was pretty much the intent, yeah. Grief isn't a switch that can be flipped off, and the events of the summer holidays helped absolve her guilt, but in my experience, simple loss is something that can come out of nowhere, even when it reminds you of things that you actually have fully moved on from.

I'm glad things are going well with you, and that you've found time to finish the VN! You might want to gather your strength before going for Rin's less than optimum endings though, at least for one in particular. I like the song, but don't know if I could really listen to it when feeling upbeat, ha. Thank you for the response.

ProfAllister wrote:Snip

Thank you for the feedback. If you've read all the comments (wow, that's a lot) then you've already seen the ones about the specifics her condition, and I don't think they bear repeating here. I will never deny that there are a slew of things in the story that I would revise, reword or otherwise change, but that's something that I won't allow myself to do, barring typos and other mechanical errors.

As for the Shakespeare, if you recall, when he and Suzu first discuss it in act 2, he says that he's read only a little, and later on she even wonders if he's begun reading more and more in an effort to impress her. From the beginning however, the Shakespeare was always something that Suzu enjoyed and that Hisao picked up later, and the only way I've been able to live with employing it is by having both of them fully aware of how cheesy his spouting romantic quotes sounds.

ProfAllister wrote:I've noticed a few people complaining about something else that bothered me. Suzu is constantly dwelling on her problems. This is realistic, believable, and annoying as all get-out. In the game, they made sure to avoid that with a simple mechanism: anything that got Hisao to dwell too much on his heart issues leads pretty much directly to the Manly Picnic. It is likely a fair representation of any internal monologue that Suzu, or any of the canon girls, would have. And most of the canon stories do dwell on the girls' issues just as much. But there's a different tone when you're on the outside. In the hypothetical Hisao viewpoint, the reader is wondering what's bugging Suzu. Slowly, you start getting a sense of who she is, and her actions start to make sense. But from the perspective we have, it's far too easy to get fed up with Suzu, ready to shout, "We get it! You have brother issues! Get over yourself already!"

This is a good point, and something I will work to improve on. You're right in that an internal thought process like this is much more likely to be seen from the girls' point of view than Hisao's, but you're also right in that just because it makes sense, that doesn't make for the most enjoyable read.

ProfAllister wrote:Alternately, it could be that it seems like that's the only thing that's on her mind, ever.

Hisao's so wonderful. It's nice going on a date with him. I'm starting to think I may have to tell him about... the incident.

As I try to decide what to eat for breakfast, I'm brought to tears by a sudden memory. Seiji loved bagels.

With a delicate touch, Hisao gently massages my breasts, occasionally flicking my nipples. I moan in pleasure, but my heart isn't in it. I know that this is just another ploy to get me to think about my future.

It may be fair to say that she thinks way too much about the stuff she doesn't want to think about. Compare it to Hisao's heart condition. With a few exceptions, Hisao doesn't really put any thought to it (often to his detriment) until it jumps in rudely and screams "Hey! Remember me?" Of course,t hat may just be a more specific version of the admonition to show, don't tell.

Well that I can't agree with, and your hypothetical examples come across as just downright rude. Comparing Hisao's heart condition to Suzu's anxiety about her future doesn't quite work, but I understand what you mean from a narrative standpoint.

ProfAllister wrote:Finally, a bit of your story suffers through no fault of your own. Having played Valkyrie Profile 2, I have a strong familiarity with Lezard's voice and facial expressions. It makes it hard to take scenes with him seriously.

That is something I will confess to having done zero research on, heh. The ethics and logistics of making what is essentially a joke character faithful to the source material are beyond me.

ProfAllister wrote:All jokes and fun aside, this is a solid, well-written story. It's quite an accomplishment, both in size and scope. It's not perfect, and there are certainly areas where it can be tweaked and tightened, but it's still very good. Hopefully my comments make sense, despite their general scatterbrainedness.

Thank you for your response and your feedback. I appreciate you taking the time to read through the entire thing and posting your thoughts, it's very helpful to me.

Daitengu wrote:Been a while since I've posted, but I do keep up.

I both thought you were dead and never knew you were interested in the story to begin with, so this is surprising, ha.

Daitengu wrote:I think the only reason the survey became a major thing Mirage, is because 'the future' is a major thing in the game. Granted I think Scissorlips is trying to tie up too many loose ends on things that will take a really long time to work out. I think it would do him better to work solely on her attitude/mindset changing so that the reader has the hope that she will "work towards wanting to resolve issues instead of run from them for a brighter future."

He's going on pretty long though, and considering track record, this latest choice to chapter probably is leading to a bad/neutral end with a couple ways of that potentially happening.

A bunch of this, I can't comment on, but I will say that the career survey hasn't been a major plot point this entire time--it went away in the same chapter it was introduced and only became an issue again in the chapter before this one, and you're right, it itself is not the source of contention. Also like you mentioned, without saying too much, please do keep in mind that a storyline branch has occurred.

Daitengu wrote:It's like the show "Big Bang Theory."

Ouch.

Thank you everyone for your honest feedback, brutal or not. I hate giving the impression that I am ignoring people, but anything I've skimmed over is probably something I hope will become clearer in time. Thank you for reading.

Also like you mentioned, without saying too much, please do keep in mind that a storyline branch has occurred.

While storyline branches are a valid (please note I didn't say "neccessary") tool in Visual novels, in a prose story you have to keep in mind that the story has to make sense all the same.
A VN that wants to lure the reader to a bad end, sometimes has to hide a potentially dangerous decision, because many readers will spot a bad end flag that is too obvious (e.g. "I was having a lot of fun" or "I'm fine")
If you use this device in a prose story it just feels... wrong.
In this specific example, Suzu decides not to go after Kenji for reasons that are perfectly understandable. The guy kidnapped her and tied her up. Every girl would be uneasy about meeting him alone. If that decision now somehow led to a bad end... Well there's no rational reason it should except for "fate" and fate is always a bad storyhook. There's also no reason this decision should worsen her neuroses.

Mirage_GSM wrote:While storyline branches are a valid (please note I didn't say "neccessary") tool in Visual novels, in a prose story you have to keep in mind that the story has to make sense all the same.
A VN that wants to lure the reader to a bad end, sometimes has to hide a potentially dangerous decision, because many readers will spot a bad end flag that is too obvious (e.g. "I was having a lot of fun" or "I'm fine")
If you use this device in a prose story it just feels... wrong.
In this specific example, Suzu decides not to go after Kenji for reasons that are perfectly understandable. The guy kidnapped her and tied her up. Every girl would be uneasy about meeting him alone. If that decision now somehow led to a bad end... Well there's no rational reason it should except for "fate" and fate is always a bad storyhook. There's also no reason this decision should worsen her neuroses.

I already understand your position on branching pathways in prose format stories, and I understand your position on "pseudo-route" type stories. That's something that we'll simply have to agree to disagree on in this case. Believe me when I say that I've spent a lot of time analyzing the different choices in the game, their consequences, their events and conditions leading up to them, and their "theme". Sometimes the choice's effects are immediate and obvious, like in Rin's "bad" end, and sometimes they aren't felt until later, like in her "neutral" one. In fact, one of my biggest worries about experimenting with playing VNs in the beginning was that it would be like those CYOA adventure books I read as a child, where if you turn left at the fork you live, if you turn right you die horribly. And that's unfortunately been the case with some of the other VNs I've played, but thankfully, it wasn't with KS.

One thing I noticed when reviewing the ingame choices is that, in many cases, they don't come down to "what do I do" very often. Usually, they consist more of "what do I think" type choices, which influence Hisao and push him along in various directions. In the end, he becomes the Hisao who possesses a specific mindset as a result of these choices, and this what brings the various endings about.

Writing a choice in any format is difficult. If things are cut and dry--for example, to dispense comfort or not?--there is no real choice, there is no real point. The best decision point consists of choices where they are all good, viable options, however, they also can't be too confusing. If you have a "good" choice and a "slightly more good" choice, it can easily be frustrating to pick the correct one. In cases like this, you have to use situation cues to give the reader an idea. Was there any indication at all that "Do you want to go into the city" was the correct choice, other than Hanako's outfit that day? If Misha hadn't attempted to kiss Hisao shortly before, how would anyone have had a clue that "comfort" would involve sexy time?

Then it becomes a balancing act. In this case, I tried to give the reader an idea of what was the best choice to make at the time without having the narration scream "oh boy, if I have to make a choice sometime soon, I should really remember to do ____". I did the same thing with the previous choice, which in my opinion was much clearer, and there are still people who have told me their choice led to the bad end.
So please, believe me when I say that I've thought about this. Whether or not the choice was clear enough is debatable, but the results will become very clear, in enough time.

I already understand your position on branching pathways in prose format stories, and I understand your position on "pseudo-route" type stories. That's something that we'll simply have to agree to disagree on in this case.

I didn't object to your use of a story branch - well I do in principle, but like you said, we had this discussion before.
My point here was that in a Fanfiction you cannot use "Gameplay reasons" as an excuse if a choice doesn't make sense.
If you say you've thought everything through and it does make sense, that's enough for me for now.

Scissorlips wrote:

Daitengu wrote:Been a while since I've posted, but I do keep up.

I both thought you were dead and never knew you were interested in the story to begin with, so this is surprising, ha.

Daitengu wrote:I think the only reason the survey became a major thing...

A bunch of this, I can't comment on, but I will say that the career survey hasn't been a major plot point this entire time--it went away in the same chapter it was introduced and only became an issue again in the chapter before this one, and you're right, it itself is not the source of contention. Also like you mentioned, without saying too much, please do keep in mind that a storyline branch has occurred.

Daitengu wrote:It's like the show "Big Bang Theory."

Ouch.

Thank you everyone for your honest feedback, brutal or not. I hate giving the impression that I am ignoring people, but anything I've skimmed over is probably something I hope will become clearer in time. Thank you for reading.

hehe, I'm normally a silent reader. I've actually been reading this since long before the Rika route story finished up. I only chime in when the story really interests me, and has room for speculation. Kinda like the old "Blind leading the Blind" story. Super interesting, lots of potential. I worry I scared away the author tho, so I've been holding it in for a long while. T.T

As for not commenting on things... that makes the surprise much more fun. ^.^

Believe it or not me comparing your story to a show like "Big Bang Theory" is actually a good thing. Normal people get a certain amount out of it, and the more.. eccentric? people get something else out of it. Story wise, I'm in the camp that knows exactly how the depressed, unsure, and fearful Suzu felt/feels, though for different reasons. Which contrasts greatly in opinion versus some of the other readers that are "gettin' tired of her crap" lol. I think it is a good thing that you've been able to attract a decent spectrum.

Catgirl Kleptocracy's Bucket List: Read 46 pages of chapters and comments for a good story. Check.

Whew, that was a long read, but well worth the time put into taking in (about tied with ProfAllister). Out of curiosity, do you have a current word count on the story?

Anyway, you've done a great job with this story so far, and it's easy to see that you've put a lot of effort into it. That's enough for a mission success right there. As you've been asking for comments in your posts, I'll write out a bit of what I thought throughout the reading. As the story is too long for me to hit everything, I'll hit what struck me the most. We'll call it The Good, The Bad, and the Neutral. I'm an optimist. Let's start with The Good.

The Good


This story makes very good use of first person, especially concerning voice. I don't think I'm breaking any new ground saying this, but Suzu is kind of a baller. Totes adorbs. We get a lot of thought out of her between all the action, and she's got a whole bunch of quirks to her thoughts that make her a tonne of fun to read. For the most part, she's hard not to like. It makes her easy to empathize with. In fact, pretty much all of the characters we're supposed to like are easy to smile at. Hisao has plenty of moments, and Miki is an all around good friend--the best kind of friend someone can have. That shows in the writing. Also, Suzu's dad is king. I wish he were my father. Props.

Dream sequences often tend to get a lot of crap. Sometimes they'll get crap simply because they're dream sequences. They work here--even the carnival fake-out. The best part is that they're all relevant and advance the story in some way. They all bring something to the table. Since Suzu spends a lot of time snoozing, it makes sense that dreams could be important to her. I think some of the best parts of this story are when the dreams are being used to advance the conflict, notably with Death in the Second and parts of the Third acts. In fact, I think he's my favorite character of the story. He's frightening, and clearly brings dread to the protagonist, but he's not evil. It seems he's even trying to help Suzu, and even empathizes with her himself. This is my own interpretation, of course, but since he is part of Suzu's dream, that does have to make him a part of her. Shows a lot of internal conflict, and since she hates him so much, I can't help but imagine that when she's dreaming of him, she's confronting a part of herself she's not entirely comfortable with. Whether that's the intent or not, I dig it. In fact, my absolute favorite part of this entire fic is the dream sequence in Future Blind (Act 3-5):

“But do you know what's stronger than fear?” He continues. “Do you know what makes someone stop running, and dig a hole, and wait for whatever comes next?”

I know. I know it pretty well. But my throat has gone completely dry.

“It's guilt.” He says softly.

“I'm not going to graduate.” I whisper.

I feel Death gently nodding behind me.

“I'm sorry.” He says.

And then I wake up.

That's bangarang. I actually had to stop for a few minutes and reread that section over a few times, and I'm not ashamed to admit that it's because I'm totes jelly. Serious kudos on all of that. Mad respect.

This story also had a very strong first act (Act 2), which I think overall is by far the best Act in the fic. The strong start really works to pull readers in, and I think it works as an anchor to keep the overall quality pretty high. Getting a good hook in the beginning is necessary for any story, and this one definitely pulls from the get-go. Despite starting to get the answers in later acts, I actually think the first section had the strongest sense of conflict, and was more consistently driving than the later sections.

There's plenty more I can say good about this story, but if you make me write it all out, it'll be longer than the fic itself. I don't think anybody wants that.

The Bad


Up in The Good, I wrote that all of the characters we are supposed to like are easy to get behind--for the most part. Here's the other 5%, and it all has to do with Lezard. See, I'm totally on Lezard's side on this one, and throughout the fic, I'm not sure I'm supposed to be. Honestly I feel bad for the guy. First, let's get this clear--I do NOT feel sorry for him for being in the situation he's in. He did that to himself, and if he'd actually ever stepped up to the plate instead of being spineless, he wouldn't be (one way or the other) where he is throughout the text. That said, the actions he's shown in the story don't justify the amount of hate he gets from our heroes, and as I'm reading it, it makes them come off as petty. In Hisao's case during Suzu's panic attack thing during the test, it even elevates to shallow and possessive. I think the situation with Kenji is the best way to compare it. With Kenji, the readers SAW Kenji do something to warrant the hate he gets. He kidnapped Hisao's girlfriend! I can totally understand why he deserved to be scorned. But with Lezard, we've never actually seen him do anything to warrant it. We're told he's an ass, and in a few scenes he does come off as a jerk, but not to the level that reflects what comes his way. He's clearly not the easiest person to deal with, but Suzu herself admits in places (between showing her contempt) that he's not bad--in fact, he's tolerable enough to eat lunch with. I'd either like to have actually seen something in story that warranted the seemingly petty dislike he gets, or keep it at a level that accurately reflects that. There's NOTHING wrong with having your main character(s) be petty--if that's what their characters are. It doesn't seem to fit with Suzu or Hisao.

I think a lot of the pacing issues in the early part of Act 3, as the story is written, have to do with the first person narrator withholding relevant information that she is actively thinking about from the audience. I wrote the basic idea of what that means in other places (Call of Yamaku), so I won't repeat it all here. If you want to know how I think it applies to this particular fic, I'd be happy to write out another post for it.

Jumping off of that, what I found to be the biggest issue--and what the other comments seem to agree on--is the pacing, specifically of the later Acts. Act 2 was great as far as pacing goes, but I think it starts to falter about midway through Act 3, and at that point kicks back in for bursts every so often, then peters off in between. I think this can be lumped in with the comments most recently seen about her constantly brooding on her issues. I agree with those posts that there's a problem. I don't agree that the constant brooding is the cause.

I don't think there's any problem with Suzu continually angsting about past and future. In fact, I like angsty. When I read I like the conflict in my face, and I don't like it to back down or cool off or give me any breathing room (breaks DO have uses, and can even be necessary at times, but what I'm saying is I like my daily dose of conflict with seconds). If you want to write this story with Suzu continually wrestling with the issues she's been struggling with, that is 100% acceptable. The problem we have is that she's been struggling with the same issues for three acts, but at this point in the story it's rare that anything new comes out of them. For example, we get a lot of tid-bits in the second half of the story along the lines of the three lines that ProfAllister quoted in his post. They're not absolutely terrible lines in and of themselves (well, maybe minus the one about her thinking about the conflict while she's getting her nipples tweaked)--the problem as I see it though is that there are a lot of chapters that have those kinds of things all over the place, but none of them actually advance the story or conflict, or give us new insight as to Suzu's internal dilemma. They're currently just serving as reminders that she's struggling with something. I think the pacing would be served if more of them were used to advance the story.

Along those same lines, there's a very noticeable shift in how the conflict is delivered to the readers, and I think that has a lot to do with the pacing in the second half. In Act 2, the main conflict is Suzu's dreams with Death. They're great, compelling, and very clearly advance the conflict. That peters off midway through Act 3, where the pacing starts to stutter, and is replaced primarily with her worries about the future and her struggle with the past (which we find out is actually the exact same conflict with a different face). To be clear, I think the past/future thing is a good conflict. It's interesting, and I like it. A lot. The issue is the delivery mechanism. Midway through Act 3, there's a drastic shift from a very concrete picture of the conflict to a very abstract picture of the conflict. Suzu's dreams in Act 2 and at some points early in Act 3 showed the reader in concrete terms what she was facing. We had a definable antagonist(?) in Death, and the dreams dealt with the conflict in concrete terms. After the shift, the vast majority of the conflict is addressed in abstract terms--general ideas such as fear of the future and self-blame, but there isn't anything concrete pushing those forward. It doesn't feel anchored down, so when Suzu says she's afraid of the career survey or the city, it's hard to believe because there's not a whole lot aside from the abstract terms for the reader to grab onto. We can't SEE it. The shift is especially jarring because we get the concrete conflict all through the beginning of the story, and then it suddenly drops out midway without any clear resolution. I'm not saying you should get rid of the abstract ideas. They're essential to this story. They might be the most important part. But we need something more concrete along with them to anchor everything down in the later Acts.

The Neutral

(You're going to have to get my second choice for this band, because they don't have a link for Lucid Dreamer on Youtube)

On the issue of narcolepsy vs. Hollywood Mystery Disease, I didn't have much of a problem. I don't know narcolepsy from necromancy, and whatever it is Suzu is actually exhibiting is interesting enough for me.

It might just be me, but I figured this was worth mentioning anyway--before we know the person Suzu is angsting over is her brother, he seemed to be described on borderline romantic terms. It was a bit of a startle to find out it was her brother. Again, might just be me, and if I need to start seeing somebody professionally, go ahead and let me know.


All in all, you've got a great fic going. It's got some things that could be ironed out, but anything that can keep my attention for 46 pages is doing quite a bit right. I'm really enjoying this, so thank you very much for putting so much time and effort into writing it. It takes a lot of energy and devotion to put something of this length and scope out, and you deserve a lot of credit for that in itself. Keep on this great story, and thanks again!