Katawa Shoujo Forums

The whole plan is what I meant, yes.

That said, a direct approach could have let Lilly make the decision for herself, too. And communication could've made it clear that Lilly was actually extremely independent in many ways.

bhtooefr wrote:The whole plan is what I meant, yes.

That said, a direct approach could have let Lilly make the decision for herself, too. And communication could've made it clear that Lilly was actually extremely independent in many ways.

Quite so. I never said her parents weren't flawed . I mean, the VN makes it clear that the family is at least somewhat dysfunctional. I just chose a different manifestation of that dysfunction than most.

IMHO, if the Satous (and a certain Nakai, for that matter) were capable of good communication, then this whole mess would never have started. Even in the good end route, it took Hisao nearly dying (again) to clear up the misunderstandings.

~~~

As far as as Lilly returning, I can imaging Hisao ending up asking "Where am i going and why am i in this handbasket?"

Her returning certainly throws everything off balance. I don't have any idea who he will pick if anyone, I have a feeling he just end up snapping from the pressure of everyone wanting a answer to their confessions and ends up with nobody

I know she was returning, it's been out there for quite a while but I still haven't figured out a way for that to happen that doesn't make everything else just... so depressing. And plus, now I don't know who to cheer for! I personally still want him to end up with Emi before Hanako, but I don't know what to do with these Lilly feels. I think one really good thing for Hisao will come out of this whole mess even if he chooses to remain alone- he might learn to actually recognize a girl's emotions! Though I actually don't think that's too overly likely, I do feel he's learned at least a little bit about how to tell when a girl is pining for him- if nothing else, he likes to think a lot and I'm sure something he's thinking about is (or should be) "How did Hanako and Emi act around me before Lilly left and what can I learn from that?" Though I guess when he awakes he might be thinking "Lilly is back? What are these feelings I can't hold?!"

Now I'm sort of thinking that this being a post-bad-end story, it'll in itself not have a happy ending at all. Which would be mighty interesting if written really well. And so far the writing is top-notch.

Carighan wrote:Now I'm sort of thinking that this being a post-bad-end story, it'll in itself not have a happy ending at all. Which would be mighty interesting if written really well. And so far the writing is top-notch.

A sad end will be...well, sad, at least for those of us who are suckers for stories with good endings.

NotSoClassy wrote:

Carighan wrote:Now I'm sort of thinking that this being a post-bad-end story, it'll in itself not have a happy ending at all. Which would be mighty interesting if written really well. And so far the writing is top-notch.

A sad end will be...well, sad, at least for those of us who are suckers for stories with good endings.

I'm getting my bubblegum fix from Sg1cat and "After Graduation", I can handle some angst in the name of good storytelling.

Carighan wrote:Now I'm sort of thinking that this being a post-bad-end story, it'll in itself not have a happy ending at all. Which would be mighty interesting if written really well. And so far the writing is top-notch.

You know, the title could be read as (Post-Lilly) Bad End rather than Post-(Lilly Bad End). Lilly's "Bad End" in the VN is technically neutral, so clearly only the former interpretation makes sense and this story must be an attempt to give her a true Bad End.

bhtooefr wrote:The interesting thing with all of that is that in Shizune's route, as of version 1.1, Lilly explicitly never actually permanently left, making it not a plot hole (and meaning that it's not an error in canon, either, so word of author would be wrong).

What do you mean "as of version 1.1"? That scene was not changed at all in version 1.1...
And I'm not really sure why Lilly's bad end should be "technically neutral" - because not everyone died in a shower of gore?

Vempele wrote:

Carighan wrote:Now I'm sort of thinking that this being a post-bad-end story, it'll in itself not have a happy ending at all. Which would be mighty interesting if written really well. And so far the writing is top-notch.

You know, the title could be read as (Post-Lilly) Bad End rather than Post-(Lilly Bad End). Lilly's "Bad End" in the VN is technically neutral, so clearly only the former interpretation makes sense and this story must be an attempt to give her a true Bad End.

*sigh* Uncle. See new thread title.

Mirage_GSM wrote:What do you mean "as of version 1.1"? That scene was not changed at all in version 1.1...

I didn't know whether it was changed or not (I've not played 1.0), although I doubted that. In any case, if a 1.2 is released, there's always the possibility that it could invalidate my comments, so...

Mirage_GSM wrote:

bhtooefr wrote:The interesting thing with all of that is that in Shizune's route, as of version 1.1, Lilly explicitly never actually permanently left, making it not a plot hole (and meaning that it's not an error in canon, either, so word of author would be wrong).

What do you mean "as of version 1.1"? That scene was not changed at all in version 1.1...
And I'm not really sure why Lilly's bad end should be "technically neutral" - because not everyone died in a shower of gore?

I think the "technically neutral" end is referencing the fact that Lilly's "Bad End" is very much like the Neutral Ends for Rin and Hanako.
Bad end implies there was a big blow-up (Emi/Hanako/Rin's Bad End) and the relationship was ruined by it. Lilly's isn't so much like that.

Steinherz wrote:

Mirage_GSM wrote:And I'm not really sure why Lilly's bad end should be "technically neutral" - because not everyone died in a shower of gore?

I think the "technically neutral" end is referencing the fact that Lilly's "Bad End" is very much like the Neutral Ends for Rin and Hanako.
Bad end implies there was a big blow-up (Emi/Hanako/Rin's Bad End) and the relationship was ruined by it. Lilly's isn't so much like that.

Yeah, I'm still relatively new to the world of visual novels, so I'm still sorting out Neutral vs. Bad (and whether Normal is the same as Neutral or a separate category all its own). So, categorization-wise, I'm just going with the flow w/r/t the thread title.

Psht. As far as I'm concerned, if there is a good end and one other end, that other end is automatically the bad end. It's bad compared to the good end, right? And there aren't any other endings for us to compare it to, right? Therefore, bad end.