Real Life KS-type Relationships

[Eldrazor]

Well here is me. Pictures of me are few and far in between. I'll probably delete this right away and regret posting it. I can't really do any pics with me holding a book as hard to angle camera. I know I need rhinnoplasty. I got reminded about that a lot growing up.

OK, I tried to give honest and complete criticism but I found that one picture is not going to be enough in the slightest.

However, I can see that you have potential. The nose, to me, isn't going to be a problem at all. You can probably do some magic visual trickery with positioning and/or shape of your glasses or something.

What made this picture look somewhat boring to me is the lighting, the colors (brown+brown+brown chair+gray background) and the hairstyle.
The hairstyle paired with the glasses makes you look way older than you probably are.

My apologies if I insulted you, it was not intended that way in the slightest.

[Eldrazor]

Playing KS got me thinking about this topic a lot and as ashamed as I am to admit it I personally don't think I'd be strong enough to date a person with severe emotional issues (whether through a disability or not). I mean just the simple act of playing this game makes me upset to my stomach sometimes. I can't imagine being personally invested in a relationship like the ones presented in KS. The more I try to put myself in that situation hypothetically the more I think I'd probably just fuck up royally and cause more harm than good. It's not that the emotional problems themselves would be the problem for me but just my inability to relate and/or handle something like that would scare the crap out of me.

There are a lot of situations where I feel like I would probably just give up and hope they can find someone better to help them. I obviously don't have experience in this situation and this is purely hypothetical but I'm almost certain that would be the case for me. The reason this makes me feel bad though is I feel like that makes me weak but if I am there is no point in trying to pretend I'm not. I don't know though love is crazy, maybe if I am thrust into a deep seeded relationship with someone similar to the KS girls (or someone relatable) maybe I could rise to the occasion.

You have to remember, though, that in Hanako's storyline it was obvious that focussing on helping Hanako was not the right thing to do. I think that in these cases what a girl usually wants is not someone that tries to solve her problems, but someone who will be there for her if she needs him and someone who will love her even when she's being emotional.

[Dreager_ex]

You have to remember, though, that in Hanako's storyline it was obvious that focussing on helping Hanako was not the right thing to do. I think that in these cases what a girl usually wants is not someone that tries to solve her problems, but someone who will be there for her if she needs him and someone who will love her even when she's being emotional.

True, and yeah I think if it came to being just supportive I'd have no problem. The problem for me would be when to know the difference I think. Kind of like with Emi's bad ending where Hisao going after her ends up making things worse. Well on the track to the bad ending since there is a chance to recover. More specifically it would be hard for me to handle being pushed away at a time when they might need you the most, that sort of scenario.

[Nekken]

I realize it's probably bad form to reply to my own post, but it's so long I wanted to break it up a little.

One more question, since many probably have never had a deep relationship with a severely disabled person:

Do you think it is a good idea for a healthy person to have a romantic relationship with someone is severely disabled?

Disabilities aren't something one should seek out in a relationship; that's either fetishizing or white-knighting, and neither possibility is a good one. You should love people, not their problems. However, if the person you love happens to have a disability and you think you can handle it, then sure, go ahead.

But be very careful about the "if you think you can handle it" part. For a healthy person, a relationship with someone who has a disability presents unique challenges, and often severe ones. Many people just can't handle it; that's so common, in fact, that most cultures don't even see any shame in not being able to do so. If you listen to people talk about those who can handle it, you'll often hear them use words like "saint" or even "angel." It's that hard.

My wife sounds much like your "S", though without the traumatic past. As the word I used for her implies, though, I got my good ending (in whatever way it can be called an ending, since as others have already pointed out, this is real life, not a game). It didn't come without hard work and a considerable amount of pain on both our parts, and there are still challenges to overcome sometimes. Neither of us is the easiest person in the world to live with, albeit for very different reasons. But it's a path that has rewards of its own, if you can deal with the challenges.

When "S" sometimes yelled at me "You can't possibly understand my pain!" I had no good reply. Maybe "I love you" is enough - but for me it wasn't. It didn't feel satisfy in the face of such suffering.

I don't know if I have the answer, but I do have an answer: to accept non-understanding. It's true that I don't understand my wife's pain, and I can't understand: not without getting into a situation that she wouldn't wish on me. I'm there anyway. It hurts me to see her in pain: not as much as her own pain hurts her, of course, but it's just as real, and so whatever way I can help make her pain a little less, that's enough for me. Yeah, my motives aren't entirely altruistic, and I hope they never are, but the fact remains that I love her. That's why I can stay even though I do not understand.

That's my answer, anyway. Yours may be different.

[Renkinjutsushi]

@ Nekken

.... Wow. Amazing. I knew I would get some interesting stories out of this thread, but that is really great. I'm glad you are able to have a fulfilling marriage together. I really admire your personal strength to stay with her, regardless of the suffering you feel from her pain (I know all about that).

Actually, I think maybe I understand such strength of commitment better than I once did. Now that my fiancee is 5 months pregnant with twins she can't do a lot of basic things without help. She hurts sometimes and in ways I will never understand as a male. It gets hard sometimes, but it's always bearable because, deep down, I know she would do exactly the same for me if the roles were reversed (wow, actually that is a strange thought...). It is a kind of temporary disability, a lot more serious than most pregnancies.

I also deal with things differently now than I did back then, with S. I don't run away from difficult situations like I did in the past. I've grown up and learned to shoulder more burdens, both for myself and for others. I guess the same feeling that led me to believe I'm ready to take responsibility as a father helps me take care of her as well. Sometimes it's frustrating or exhausting. But that's okay - it's our life and we are happy together. Wouldn't have it any other way.

[Alexbond45]

This is really inspiring to read.


(I Wish I had a picture of me in my Marching Uniform, with the fixings and everything, With my head pointed down, the Shako covering my face, and me holding a Colourguard Rifle or something because It seems to really fit how I prow the forums )

[Beoran]

Nekken: You're hitting the nail squarely on the head, when you say we have to accept not understanding the other's pain. But actually it's more general: in reality no one can /truly/ understand what it feels like to be someone else, or what they are suffering, since it's impossible to look inside another's person's brain and feel exactly what they feel. Of course, it's possible to feel something "similar", but that is not a complete "understanding".

However, I think that this goes for *all* relationships. We want the other to understand our own feelings, and the other also wants that we understand theirs. But such true, complete "understanding" is almost impossible. But a general, rational "understanding" of the indirect kind is possible. And also possible are attention, respect and support, being there when the other person needs you, consideration of their feelings even if you don't understand them completely, etc, etc... In short we are not gods who can read minds and set problems straight with a snap of the fingers. But we can be humans to other humans, and often, that will be enough.

Micechaseskittens, it's brave of you to post your photograph. Actually, what I think is that only one important thing about how you look is "wrong": you don't smile. It may sound corny and cheap for me to say this, and I hope uyou'll forgive me, but I'd love to see you smile happily. I think you'll be drop-dead gorgeous when you smile. I so I think the real issue is not your nose, it's the incessant bullying you've had to suffer, and all the consequences of that.

You mentioned having a nose job done. Sorry to discuss this topic with you, I hope you'll forgive me but I feel I have to say a word or two. Now, personally I think that there's no need for having your nose modified, since you look fine to me. However, sometimes and for some people, it requires an actual physical change to make yourself understand that you're are going to change, and not be the person who suffers from the past wounds anymore. So, I'd say, don't have a nose job done for anyone else's sake. But if you feel that your confidence will improve afterwards, I'd encourage you to have it done for yourself, for your own sake. So that your smile will slowly start to return. Eh, sorry again if that sounds cheap. :p

[micechasekittens]

Micechaseskittens, it's brave of you to post your photograph. Actually, what I think is that only one important thing about how you look is "wrong": you don't smile. It may sound corny and cheap for me to say this, and I hope uyou'll forgive me, but I'd love to see you smile happily. I think you'll be drop-dead gorgeous when you smile. I so I think the real issue is not your nose, it's the incessant bullying you've had to suffer, and all the consequences of that.

You mentioned having a nose job done. Sorry to discuss this topic with you, I hope you'll forgive me but I feel I have to say a word or two. Now, personally I think that there's no need for having your nose modified, since you look fine to me. However, sometimes and for some people, it requires an actual physical change to make yourself understand that you're are going to change, and not be the person who suffers from the past wounds anymore. So, I'd say, don't have a nose job done for anyone else's sake. But if you feel that your confidence will improve afterwards, I'd encourage you to have it done for yourself, for your own sake. So that your smile will slowly start to return. Eh, sorry again if that sounds cheap. :p

I hate my smile. Some people say it is nice, but it is this conniving, half smirk like I had just slipped poison into someone's wine glass. I may share a lot with Hanako, but not her cute smile. Growing up, they tried to force me to smile and I never could. I try to smile in the mirror but it looks so fake. Thanks for encouragement, though I know I look boring and plain.

[Renkinjutsushi]

I hate my smile. Some people say it is nice, but it is this conniving, half smirk like I had just slipped poison into someone's wine glass. I may share a lot with Hanako, but not her cute smile. Growing up, they tried to force me to smile and I never could. I try to smile in the mirror but it looks so fake. Thanks for encouragement, though I know I look boring and plain.

A forced smile isn't a real smile. I think the point behind Hanako's smile being so special is that she almost never shows it, because she is constantly depressed until quite far into the story.

I actually have issues with my smile as well, because my teeth are extremely small and jagged. If I smile too widely, I tend to look like a vicious wolf or vampire or something lol... Recently, I've been working on my smile though. Public presentation is so important in my profession (attorney) that I have to do so. I used mirrors and also video exercises to get more comfortable with various facial expressions and verbal tics.

Basically the idea was to film yourself giving a speech, then watch it and critique your own performance. Then repeat until you are happier with your public presentation. I have to admit, it was really hard to do this - unexpectedly hard. Sometimes I wanted to reach out and strangle my own image on the video, shouting "You idiot! How can you do something so stupid!"

But it did work. After about 3 times, I felt a lot better. I found myself speaking more clearly, looking my audience (myself in this case) directly in the eye and making a better use of expressions and intonation. The greatest benefit was more confidence in myself, especially in public situations. I started to figure out how I could "connect" with others by making the best use of my own voice and face.

I won't lie - these practices are very, very hard. You may want to cry, throw things at the screen, etc. I did. But for me the benefits were worth it. Being able to go into a room full of strangers and have some confidence that I have at least a degree of control over how they "view me" is remarkably comforting and empowering.

[Beoran]

I hate my smile. Some people say it is nice, but it is this conniving, half smirk like I had just slipped poison into someone's wine glass. I may share a lot with Hanako, but not her cute smile. Growing up, they tried to force me to smile and I never could. I try to smile in the mirror but it looks so fake. Thanks for encouragement, though I know I look boring and plain.

Sorry, that turned out all wrong! I hope I did not hurt your feelings... What you seemed to have understood, was not really not what I ment or wanted to say at all, so I sincerely apologize for not communicating more clearly, and if I made you feel bad in any way.

Let me clarify my point though. What I ment with "smile" was, it would be great if you would be a bit happier. Or at least, content. Contrary to what you say, I think you are a very interesting person, but seeing such a photo, I just feel... drat, I wish you were just a bit more genuinely happy. I know it's not something that can be solved in a day, and it's not something I could realistically help you with, but still, that's my honest feeling. I'm sorry to bother you with my two cents compassion, and with my clumsy ways of trying to be helpful to you. I know it must feel cheap for me to say such things, but still, I selfishly want to say these things, because I hope to learn from you too how I can improve my ways of communicating.

Also, before, I also didn't smile heartily very much. Actually, I still don't smile happily too much. I tried to fake it too but it just doesn't work. A smile is like money, no one likes it if it's fake. My wife also remarked when I was smirking, she disliked it too, she hoped for my true smile. But, now, well, there's our daughter. And how she smiles! She's teaching me how to truly and warmly smile every day! It's something amazing even for me. It's something I wish for everyone here, to be able to smile happily like a child without any worries at all.

Edit: Renkinjustushi. I know the feeling. When I was a teenager I destroyed all tapes I had recorded before with my own voice on them, that's how embarassed I was. But I guess I should have learned from them. What you suggest is a good idea, for people who are ready for it. I think.. I'm not that far yet though. :p

[velocimackerel]

I did my first playthrough on Emi... I have no idea how I did not get the bad end since I pressed every issue and tried to get close. Everyone seems to say that nagging her about her problems and such leads to the bad end but I guess I was lucky.

This game just reminded me how empty my own romantic relationships have been.

[Alexbond45]

@micechasekittens
Doesn't Matter how well you smile, If another Person Cares about you, They won't care about how bad It is, but instead know that you are smiling and like it.

However, How should I know, I'm not a Relationship expert, I am a guy and on the spectrum of looks, I am at literally -2, I don't Give a Damn, I am very not-Observant on looks, and This is good and bad (I won't Notice a new hair style, but I also won't notice the bad Hair Style) The Only, AND THE ONLY, Article Of Clothing I WILL EVER JUDGE: Is Marching Band Uniforms, because some look awesome, and some don't. Seriously.

[micechasekittens]

I'm trying more to step out of my shell and want to talk to more people so umm anyone who wants to talk to a girl similar to Hanako who loves games, please send an IM. -_- Understandably many people wanted to be Hanako's guards in that one thread though I don't look cute like her, but yeah love to talk to more people and stop hiding so much from interaction. Might start rambling cause feel nervous, but it would be nice to make more friends.

[Paddy]

Well here is me. Pictures of me are few and far in between. I'll probably delete this right away and regret posting it. I can't really do any pics with me holding a book as hard to angle camera. I know I need rhinoplasty. I got reminded about that a lot growing up.

I'll admit, dat nose...
But it's really not too bad. I would have to see more, but it looks like you've got a really good face overall.

I hate my smile. Some people say it is nice, but it is this conniving, half smirk like I had just slipped poison into someone's wine glass. I may share a lot with Hanako, but not her cute smile. Growing up, they tried to force me to smile and I never could. I try to smile in the mirror but it looks so fake. Thanks for encouragement, though I know I look boring and plain.

You do NOT look like Snidely Whiplash.
Don't try to smile. No one has a good "forced smile". It's a scientifically proven fact that the more any given member of the human race tries to smile by saying to himself again and again, "Smile... smile..." the less he looks like he's smiling and the more like a psychopath he looks. You're hardly alone. My forced smile makes me look like a real creep, too.

But when you get a real smile, that comes from something that really does make you happy, you gonna be cute.

I'm trying more to step out of my shell and want to talk to more people so umm anyone who wants to talk to a girl similar to Hanako who loves games, please send an IM. -_- Understandably many people wanted to be Hanako's guards in that one thread though I don't look cute like her, but yeah love to talk to more people and stop hiding so much from interaction. My aim and skype are micechasekitten. My yahoo is cerealnmuffin. Might start rambling cause feel nervous, but it would be nice to make more friends.

Good luck and Godspeed, love. I hope you find Mr. Right somewhere, even if not here.

The Good Lord will bring you something wonderful. I promise you.

[amentoraz]

This is an interesting topic.

In "dating the disabled" I can only speak of dating "people with problems" more in a psychological sense. I find this the only relevant thing here, the inner thing of the person that you are dating. I couldn't care less if the person I'm dating is "disabled" in some physical sense, I aim for the mind behind the body. Even in some cases such like Rin in KS, I could even become fascinated on the way they get through their disabilities. But whatever, in the end of the day I'm interested in the person I'm communicating with, not in specific disability "circumstances" which are mostly irrelevant.

Now for the "psychologically disabled", though its neither a good way to call it.

I guess when I was younger I thought broken girls or girls with deep problems would make interesting and deep people. Turned out I was somehow wrong. Problems aren't necessarily related to depth. They may make you think more than if you just go through life without really deep problems, but they don't necessarily make you deeper, nor a good person. In fact, dealing with a few relationships with "broken people", I've learned the importance of inner strength. I hate weak people. And please don't get me wrong; for example Hanako shows in her path she isn't really weak, which for me saved the arc and made me connect a bit with her in the end. What I mean by weak is, weak people are those who spill their shit over others when they can't cope with their problems, weak people are those who will do anything to defend themselves even if it involves betraying others just to save themselves. It is in this sense that I hate weak people. I've had close friendships in which these people would do anything to save themselves when under stress, in a surprisingly egotistical way.

Also I've always been quite eager to do things by myself, including solving your own problems. Thus I've never bought the white-knight approach. I was deeply depressive and even suicidal as a teenager, and the only way I could finally end up with that in my mid-twenties was by learning to overcome depression myself and becoming increasingly responsible of my own states of mind, a task which I still make an effort to carry out daily so that I can inhabit the mental states I want to live in. So really, psychological "disabilities" which are the only ones that matter or that's how I think, can be overcomed anyway.