Would you play a "mental disability" VN similar to KS?

[Carnificus]

I think that both an episodic approach and the harem approach have their merits and demerits, and in the end I would enjoy writing for either type. The one thing that stands out for me in KS' take on the harem approach, however, is that I formed a sort of emotional bond with the school itself. Between Hisao's lovingly-crafted descriptions of the grounds and the air of acceptance that Yamaku tries to promote for its students, I started to feel strangely... "At home" there if that makes any sense, to the point where I'd even feel a sense of calm when returning to it after leaving for an extended period during a few of the girl's paths.

I dunno man, this game does things to me.

I agree, I really liked Yamaku itself and I feel like I would enjoy a VN of this nature more with the same type of setting. I think the problem with something like a prison system or a psych ward is that neither of them conjure up anything other than bad feelings. I mean when I think psych ward my mind flashes to "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest." I like the idea of a setting that can be lighthearted when it wants to be, I just don't feel like there's as much of an emotional connection when you spend the whole game in a very heavy, depressing, setting. So something like a school appeals to me, and I feel like with some decent writing involved you could convince the reader that a school that caters specifically to mentally disabled students isn't out of the realm of possibilities. Unfortunately I feel like outside of doing something like a special school of that sort you would have to do a lot more work to explain how these characters come into contact, and while I can suspend my belief to think there's a special school for the mentally disabled I'd have a much harder time believing that this MC manages to coincidentally only run into a slew of girls with different mental disorders.

[Mirage_GSM]

NIce to see you having a good start. Best wishes to your project.
A bit of advice, if you want it:
- Be aware that this concept has even more potential to go wrong than KS...
- I do recommend Kosher's Fanfic Kyouki Shoujo, that he linked on page one in this thread for inspiration on how to write mentally disabled characters.
- Don't discuss relevant plot or character details on public forums too much.
- Don't choose a japanese school as a setting. There are several interesting alternative ideas in this thread already.

Right now, I'm a bit busy with other stuff, but if this gets off the ground, I might be able to help as a proofreader/editor later on.
I'll follow this thread for progress reports.

[Rivan]

Nah. I'm afraid I'd always go for the hot psychopath and get downer a.k.a dead ending.

It is an interesting idea, you'd just have to pick things that are not too destructive and, preferably, not too commonly known.

The setting should NOT, by any means, be a school in Japan.

Maybe a small town with lots of resocialization/psychiatrist/psychologist staff, or a medical center with a psychiatric ward instead. You could be a patient or a nurse, with one possible romantic interests being a doctor herself (just to feed some fetishists ).

It is an interesting idea, just one that is hard to make properly.

[imperial.standard]

If it were my call, I'd have the setting be a psychiatric hospital

I think my earlier suggestion of a school for children with behaviour problems and such could work.

I'm warming up to Qbert's suggestion of a group home, though there's still a confining, small feel to a place like that, at least as I picture it. This could augment the sense of it being homey, if done right, or it could turn it claustrophobic.

I think, having experienced being schooled in a college with complete dorm system (a Jesuit institution) and the way they handle their students' potential + internal troubles, it could be great that if the setting should be set in a college ASSISTING these troubled students -grouped into classes with categories of similar mental problems:
- those being "light" in nature means semi-independence and enables the student to interact with outside world (not confined to dormitories)
- the "heavy" ones would mean full time confinement. (in the dorm or ward)

In short, it's like Yamaku in KS with an attached psychiatric ward & dorm. This will combine the best of ideas and explore a wide possibility of stories;

- should the girl of choice be of those with "light" mental disability, the pair may choose to do their activity outside of school grounds
- should the girl of choice be of those with "heavy" mental disability, this may even turn into an emotional journey that may not even be romance. As Qbert has said, people committed to psychiatric wards are normally a danger to themselves and others but interactions with them may sometimes make you question about some values you hold dear in life.

How's that sound?

Also about the setting - I think we're quite set it should be Europe, but Europe where?

I am personally a bit favoring central Europe (particularly Vienna & Prague) with their history of psychoanalysis, beautiful architecture and the presence of highly competent colleges with dorms - but some other places like Nijmegen or Moscow came to mind. For darker VNs I would recommend Bucharest.

Any other suggestions? I do know that we are not supposed to say that the setting is explicitly in certain real life city, but the locales may affect how the story & background went anyway.

Now if you'll excuse me I will be away for a while to make some early drafts of art.

[QbertEnhanced]

I second the suggestion of Vienna as a setting, the potential to make a really compelling environment there is amazing. A truly beautiful city.
Plus, this suggestion of a school with an attached psychiatric ward is starting to make the most sense to me. It'd allow for an entire range of characters ranging from simply troubled to severely dysfunctional. A story about the values people hold on to could make for a very interesting "non-romance" plot and as far as I know would be rather unique in that sense.

[Merlyn_LeRoy]

Nah. I'm afraid I'd always go for the hot psychopath and get downer a.k.a dead ending.

You might be thinking more psychopath than sociopath (and yes, there are discussions of the differences at sociopathworld.com). I think a sociopath would just drop the relationship.

Some other "type" suggestions: kleptomaniac, OCD (not sure if mentioned already), bipolar (manic/depressive, maybe tends to stop taking meds because it makes life too dull a la Abbie Hoffman).

[Metal Handkerchief]

If this ever gets off the ground, I'd love to contribute music.

[imperial.standard]

I second the suggestion of Vienna as a setting, the potential to make a really compelling environment there is amazing. A truly beautiful city.

YESSSS someone has agreed with me that Vienna is an awesome setting for an eroge!! I mean...VISUAL NOVEL

That joke aside, again the landmarks are too numerous to have background for the story to roll forward. Be it a relaxing date with the female character at Kafe Zentrum, shopping for Christmas presents at the Christmas Market, or have one of the many Catholic colleges there to stand in as our very own "Yamaku"

Plus, this suggestion of a school with an attached psychiatric ward is starting to make the most sense to me. It'd allow for an entire range of characters ranging from simply troubled to severely dysfunctional. A story about the values people hold on to could make for a very interesting "non-romance" plot and as far as I know would be rather unique in that sense.

Not to mention able to insert a wider range of characters instead. I am looking for some reference of schools that can be used as background.

Ok as I promised in the other forum that I will do some artwork concepting. First I would apologize for the crappy picture as my scanner broke so I took the pictures with my BB camera instead. Second I only have a few hours left for the weekend so I can only sketch my first 4 before I move on something else. Now here goes nothing;

Uniform concept!!


Nothing too fancy, based on the typical parochial school with summer, spring-autumn, and winter schemes. Colours would be nothing bright - with plaid trousers/skirts, black cardigan sweaters with double white edge stripes (with school logo on right chestpocket), white shirt with striped tie. Additional clothing item would be black/navy blue blazers with school logo on right chestpocket and stripped scarves.

Secondary Characters - Teacher


From Left to Right;
- Expy of Sigmund Freud. Smokes cigars like a chimney. Abrasive, direct, and a very cynical person but nonetheless a well intentioned and professional teacher who monitors the mental health of the students in the college and warns the player / target character of certain conducts / emotions that may go out of line and jeopardize their own mental stability. Definitely not someone to come to when you have romantic problems.

- Expy of Brian Blessed. School Principal (but not Rector) character. Loud, dominant, but very understanding and knows when to turn a blind eye when needed. Based on main characters' choices maybe his greatest ally or his worst enemy.

- Megane Math Teacher - nicknamed ice queen. Known for her trademark braid hairstyle as well as her uptight teaching style. The coach for math olympics team of the college.

Now for the proposed main characters!

Depressed Girl / Bandaged Babe / Suicidal Babe

Name: Katja Böhm
Background: She came from a broken family; the father had a failed career and committed numerous domestic and sexual abuse to both his wife and daughter before killed by his wife - and then the wife committed suicide shortly afterwards. With no relatives willing to take her in she began to show signs of severe depression, tendency to inflict injury on herself and has tried to commit suicide more than once. The state then ordered her to be committed to St Stephen's Gymnasium for both observation, help and ultimately cure her current condition. At this college she will meet the main character who would bring one of the biggest change in her life.

Head Injury Girl / Lolita

Name: Louise von Habsburg
Background: Born as Agatha Schneider, she suffered a terrible traffic accident. One of the debris lodged itself in her head and is too risky to be removed by surgery. The head trauma resulted in her behavioral change and from that moment one she is convinced that she is a long lost member of the Habsburg family and started to dress in Lolita fashion, calling herself "Habsburg Rose". She wore a hat to cover the sticking head injury and one thing that may severely upset this normally unflappable cheery girl is to have her remove her hat. Her biggest fear is to have the head corrective surgery done as it may proceed to destroy her current personality and turn her into something she doesn't know.

There you go. All designs are not final and feel free to give feedback!

Some notes; the picture is actually cropped. Look at the direct link to view full sized picture

If this ever gets off the ground, I'd love to contribute music.

Chief! Please draft the above person - we haven't got a musician on our team...reverbnation

[PlayfulMind]

If there is to be a school setting there are several ways to approach it. These three types of schools all exist, I can't think of anymore at the moment as I am on my lunch break.

1. A normal high school, each student with mental disabilities has a special education assistant, with a special class separate for those that are behind due to hospital visits or their disability. If the MC also has an mental disability this allows him to interact with others that have mental disabilities and at a the same have normal school life constantly there as a foliage. Maybe throw in a girl with no disabilities whatsoever. You can also then tackle the problem of bullying and alienation, cause it does happen. The main problem is that the disabilities cannot be too severe that it interferes with school. They will most likely allow any type of disability in until it seems to not work or is obviously too severe.

2. A high school for disabilities, these are waning in existence cause parents want their kids to be in normal high schools so that when they come out they can fit into society better. This allows for more severe disabilities, but they must also accept those with physical disabilities, as they have no right to turn them down, you might not interact as much with them with the social cliques but they will be around. The problem with this is also severity, those that need to be in a hospital almost 24/7 won't really fit in here.

3. A post secondary institute, be it college, university, or institute, the students would have most likely developed coping mechanism for their problems. It will not be as visible. There are support groups and clubs that may allow some sense in how the MC meets the girls. This allows the MC to disassociate himself from the school as it is larger, and most post secondary institutes do not have such a great community that everyone knows everyone and are friends. The main problem with this might be that the girls cope with it so well that is is barely visible or only visible under certain circumstances.

[deadleaves]

I'd like to contribute to this project if it ever becomes something, So whoever is trying to organize people together should send me a PM, or direct me to whoever I should contact.

I think I could have a lot to offer the project in terms of experience and knowledge on the subject.

[Rivan]

Depressed Girl / Bandaged Babe / Suicidal Babe
http://i1270.photobucket.com/albums/jj6 ... 6-0203.jpg
Name: Katja Böhm
Background: She came from a broken family; the father had a failed career and committed numerous domestic and sexual abuse to both his wife and daughter before killed by his wife - and then the wife committed suicide shortly afterwards. With no relatives willing to take her in she began to show signs of severe depression, tendency to inflict injury on herself and has tried to commit suicide more than once. The state then ordered her to be committed to St Stephen's Gymnasium for both observation, help and ultimately cure her current condition. At this college she will meet the main character who would bring one of the biggest change in her life.

DON'T go there. Seriously. Just don't. There aren't many ways to solve a character like that, and I fear a Hanako rip-off if we try to do it "originally".

A character with a tendency to injure herself/one that doesn't appreciate life is fine, but I'd rather have the ax-crazy, reckless kind of character take that position than another sad girl with a sad past. Not to mention most cultures don't deal well with "rape as backstory", and especially not well with "paternal rape as backstory". Also, proved by Silent Hill 2, such characters have a tendency to quickly suceed with their suicidal attempts...

[imperial.standard]

Thanks for the advice! It's not final as noted in my comments above but here's a bit of defence...

DON'T go there. Seriously. Just don't. There aren't many ways to solve a character like that, and I fear a Hanako rip-off if we try to do it "originally".

It wasn't intended as original character. I had exposure to quite a number of mental problems before and just trying to fit something that I have experience with. By the way do remember Hanako tries to escape by running to the library. Katja tries to kill herself and end it all...at least that's what I thought. It's up to the chief and writer to decide whether to use her or not.

Not to mention most cultures don't deal well with "rape as backstory", and especially not well with "paternal rape as backstory". Also, proved by Silent Hill 2, such characters have a tendency to quickly suceed with their suicidal attempts...

No culture deals well with rape in general well (except some cultures in Africa or Southeast Asia) ,so I think it's a bit of our lofty to goal to present their mental problems as sensitive and tasteful as KS was.

As for the success of suicidal attempts, at least the background/setting and interaction with the main character would hopefully have a major effect in stopping that from happening.

[Rivan]

Thanks for the advice! It's not final as noted in my comments above but here's a bit of defence...

DON'T go there. Seriously. Just don't. There aren't many ways to solve a character like that, and I fear a Hanako rip-off if we try to do it "originally".

It wasn't intended as original character. I had exposure to quite a number of mental problems before and just trying to fit something that I have experience with. By the way do remember Hanako tries to escape by running to the library. Katja tries to kill herself and end it all...at least that's what I thought. It's up to the chief and writer to decide whether to use her or not.

Not to mention most cultures don't deal well with "rape as backstory", and especially not well with "paternal rape as backstory". Also, proved by Silent Hill 2, such characters have a tendency to quickly suceed with their suicidal attempts...

No culture deals well with rape in general well (except some cultures in Africa or Southeast Asia) ,so I think it's a bit of our lofty to goal to present their mental problems as sensitive and tasteful as KS was.

As for the success of suicidal attempts, at least the background/setting and interaction with the main character would hopefully have a major effect in stopping that from happening.

I honestly don't believe anyone fully normal can get into a head of a suicidal family rape victim and write it both truthfully, belieaveably, and tastefully. It is just my opinion, though. Actually, if the idea passess, I think Angela from Silent Hill 2 is a good inspiration ( I mentioned her before), but of course, books, movies, etc. could also serve.

I'd love to provide some writing, but my capability to do so would depend on the time in which the project would start. I pretty much have to work my ass off on university.

If only I was a few years younger (or older...)

[Arifu]

Thanks for the advice! It's not final as noted in my comments above but here's a bit of defence...

DON'T go there. Seriously. Just don't. There aren't many ways to solve a character like that, and I fear a Hanako rip-off if we try to do it "originally".

It wasn't intended as original character. I had exposure to quite a number of mental problems before and just trying to fit something that I have experience with. By the way do remember Hanako tries to escape by running to the library. Katja tries to kill herself and end it all...at least that's what I thought. It's up to the chief and writer to decide whether to use her or not.

Not to mention most cultures don't deal well with "rape as backstory", and especially not well with "paternal rape as backstory". Also, proved by Silent Hill 2, such characters have a tendency to quickly suceed with their suicidal attempts...

No culture deals well with rape in general well (except some cultures in Africa or Southeast Asia) ,so I think it's a bit of our lofty to goal to present their mental problems as sensitive and tasteful as KS was.

As for the success of suicidal attempts, at least the background/setting and interaction with the main character would hopefully have a major effect in stopping that from happening.

In any case, I think the art is coming along great. I can really see a lot of depth coming from a characters like Katya, though i can imagine that if KS was as gut wrenchingly touching and deep as it was, then this project is gonna have me completely shut down emotionally for weeks (though i'm still pretty much like that from KS)

[Merlyn_LeRoy]

I'm fine with Vienna as a setting, too. And I forgot to include a cutter as a possible character type (the cutter probably wouldn't be the suicidal character).

A Freud expy might be too obvious/trite. Is there a particular reason for one?

A possible story dynamic for one character could be that she constantly lies to her therapist, and tells the MC this, so the MC sort-of becomes her therapist by proxy (Liza Minnelli has said how her mother Judy Garland would lie to her therapist and laugh about it with Liza).

Great art style there, Imperial.