Katawa Shoujo Forums

karl hungus wrote:I loved this route, I'd give it a 4 or a 5 for sure. The emotional ups and downs are nearly unbearable, but it's worth it in the end.

One thing I was confused about. Right before he decides to dash for the airport, Hisao gets hit with this notion that he was neglecting Lilly in some way, or not doing something he should have been doing. He said "I just let everything happen, never trying to help Lilly" What exactly should he have helped her with? I mean, he implied that she left because she didn't want to be a burden, but that doesn't tell all that much. Did he regret not telling her she wasn't a burden? Maybe I'm looking too deep into this but I'm not sure.

It's implied Lilly doesn't really want to go, and that she's hates to lose people close to her (hanako & hisao). So Hisao thought he'd put up a fight before she left and be there for her.

Lilly made that decision by herself, the point of the story is Hisao entering her life and them being together through the future. Something like that...can someone else explain?

After a week or so of finishing Lilly's , I started Hanako's, for some reason I didn't really feel comfortable with it. I just felt it too dense, not to mention that when you have sex with her, it felt like Hisao was raping her, I didn't feel like the pleasure was mutual really, it just felt so forced to me.

When I finished Hanako's and was like "meh" (although I did get some feelings, it wasn't nearly as strong as what I felt during Lilly's route), I started Emi's route. That kind of cheered me up though, because when I finished Emi's route I actually felt like I'd fallen in love with yet another character, and it made me understand that sometimes you may feel like whatever you've got right now is the best you'll ever get, and you don't want anything other than it, but if that thing you've got goes away, you'll eventually something else to strive for that'll make you feel like that, or even more. It's just a matter of patience, really.

Still, nothing beats the feelings during Lilly's route to me, it just felt so real sometimes, although I agree that the ending was a little bit cliché (as in hollywood like) I still loved it. Anyway, I found Emi's good ending a bit more realistic, maybe. But who am I to judge? Who knows what I'd do if the person I'm in love with was leaving simply due to family summons, when she can actually get along just fine where she's at (It'd be a different story if Lilly's family was actually in Japan and they were all moving to Scotland, that'd be a lot sadder since she's got a LOT more emotional weight on her shoulders ). I felt like Emi's route was the most realistic one to me (at least as far as I know how relationships go, but I'm sure that there's people like Lilly, and those kind of relationships exist as well!), but the most beautiful one was Lilly's. (I still have to do Rin and Shizune, but I can't be arsed to.)

Anyway, I'm giving it a 5/5 because I just loved it and it made me feel so sad, yet so good. I didn't cry at the good ending, but I couldn't breathe, it was like time stopped and I assimilated myself with the novel, begging out loud that things would work out, I felt alive for once, I felt like I was actually feeling something inside of me, something that I'd look up to, something that drives me to live the day-by-day as in a quest to finally be happy.

Just like that very famous image that talks about the KS feelings, I'm pursuing mine, and although I've got my own issues to keep up with, I'm kind of sure that I'll eventually feel them in my own skin.

I know this has nothing to do with what I just said, but I cried when I heard the "Afternoon" track, I don't know why that soundtrack gets the best of me and makes me feel happy, yet sad. It's a lovely song.

Dammit, I went far off topic, I'm really sorry!

Sorry for the wall of text, too :B

I send you all my best regards!

Far off topic? Not really
Wall of text? Well thats okay.

Glad that another person liked this game.

Althamus wrote:

eklektik wrote:Would any of you actually date someone who commonly uses the phrase "My, my"? There are lots of really likeable and respectful things about Lilly, but I found her to be quite a dry and conservative person during alot of the dialouge. It might be her overbearing formalities that made it hard for me to connect to her.

/wrist

I say that.
And act like that as well sometimes too.

I feel you, bro.

Personally I find it endearing when someone's mannerisms are far different than what is considered to be normal, or commonplace. One of the reasons I like Lilly so much was because she spoke and conducted herself in such a "proper" way, while most everyone else acted so much differently from her.

Titus wrote:

karl hungus wrote:I loved this route, I'd give it a 4 or a 5 for sure. The emotional ups and downs are nearly unbearable, but it's worth it in the end.

One thing I was confused about. Right before he decides to dash for the airport, Hisao gets hit with this notion that he was neglecting Lilly in some way, or not doing something he should have been doing. He said "I just let everything happen, never trying to help Lilly" What exactly should he have helped her with? I mean, he implied that she left because she didn't want to be a burden, but that doesn't tell all that much. Did he regret not telling her she wasn't a burden? Maybe I'm looking too deep into this but I'm not sure.

It's implied Lilly doesn't really want to go, and that she's hates to lose people close to her (hanako & hisao). So Hisao thought he'd put up a fight before she left and be there for her.

Lilly made that decision by herself, the point of the story is Hisao entering her life and them being together through the future. Something like that...can someone else explain?

Duty is held pretty highly in Japan (AFAIK), and Lilly holds her family in pretty high regard as well. It's implied that she feels obligated to do as her parents tell her and go to Scotland, rather than doing it because she wants to; in which case Hisao is able to tell her that all her friends and life is remaining in Japan, and she will be leaving all that behind to go back to Scotland. He also AFAICR doesn't object to her returning at all after it is brought up -> dash to the airport, which was the quoted regret from him.
Also, to another extent, I think Hisao felt that Lilly helped him so much, but he never helped her (which she refutes).

Would any of you actually date someone who commonly uses the phrase "My, my"? There are lots of really likeable and respectful things about Lilly, but I found her to be quite a dry and conservative person during alot of the dialouge. It might be her overbearing formalities that made it hard for me to connect to her. But hey, these are just initial thoughts. Did anyone feel the same?

Somewhat. It was always my impression that the "my, my" was part of Lilly's lady persona. A good way to describe Lilly would be "pleasant but subtly distant". Like Emi, Lilly feels her burdens are hers and hers alone to carry and her formality is a way to keep people at a bit of a distance, but she's so nice and polite most people don't really realize they're being kept at arm's length. So in a nutshell:

Lilly in her refined lady role:
"My, my. There's no need to change your speech on my account."

Lilly dropping her refined lady role:
"I love you. I love you. I love you. I love you. I love you."

It usually takes a heart attack to drop her guard completely though.

After a week or so of finishing Lilly's , I started Hanako's, for some reason I didn't really feel comfortable with it. I just felt it too dense, not to mention that when you have sex with her, it felt like Hisao was raping her, I didn't feel like the pleasure was mutual really, it just felt so forced to me.

It WAS forced. That was the whole point of the scene. Neither was emotionally ready for sex, the intercourse was completely a physical thing and neither enjoyed it very much. Hanako just initiated it because she thought it was the only way to keep Hisao from losing interest in her and Hisao merely went along because he figured this was what he was expected to do. It was BECAUSE the whole thing felt so empty that Hisao initiates their talk in the park afterwards.

One thing I was confused about. Right before he decides to dash for the airport, Hisao gets hit with this notion that he was neglecting Lilly in some way, or not doing something he should have been doing. He said "I just let everything happen, never trying to help Lilly" What exactly should he have helped her with? I mean, he implied that she left because she didn't want to be a burden, but that doesn't tell all that much. Did he regret not telling her she wasn't a burden? Maybe I'm looking too deep into this but I'm not sure.

Coaxed into the role by Lilly's mothering tendencies, Hisao kinda developed a relationship with Lilly that wasn't completely on equal terms. He was leaning on her. Big time. And she was letting him. (this mirrors the relationship Hisao develops with Hanako in her arc) Lilly was the one initiating the confession, the sex and the dates. She gave him emotional support while he was still acclimatising to the school, but he didn't pry when she seemed troubled. (this was Lilly's fault too, she's so afraid of being a burden to people she wouldn't share her troubles with Hisao) And when Akira tells Hisao about their parents' summoning and Hisao confronts Lilly about it, he doesn't question or challenge her decision despite the fact she doesn't seem confident about it at all...instead he goes along with it as if it's not his place to argue with her. When she says they could have a long distance relationship, "That's BS and we both know it" is what Hisao thinks, but again he doesn't speak up. He could have changed her mind if he had argued her decision, but he just let her walk away. In the good end, Hisao realizes he should have pressed Lilly a little more and told her it was okay to let him help her shoulder her burdens instead of going along with her non-confrontational attitude just to stay in their comfortable, but not quite healthy pattern.

People tend to say Lilly's route lacks a central conflict unlike other routes. I'd say the lack of conflict is the central conflict. Or rather...Lilly's tendency to avoid conflict even when doing so leads to bigger issues down the road. But it's a lot more subtle than, say, Emi's issues.

Choosing naturally, I felt most attracted to Hanako first, but ended up first in Emi good and Hanako good, then Lily good. The Lily path is really a showstopper for me. So much that it almost should have been an unlockable path. If I had ended up in the Lily path first, the only other girl I'd re-play KS for would be Hanako, and I would have missed the Emi path which turned out to be good in another way. Feels like Shizune will forever be part of the extended in-laws now, and Rin will be a bro.

geekahedron wrote:I think Lilly's route is not just the best for her and for Hisao, but Hanako's independence is even better for her than in her own storyline!

Considering the Hanako path ends before Lily comes back from Scotland, and she's already kissing in public by then I'd still say Hanako will end up at least as good in her own path as in Lily's, though she gets there in a more traumatic way.

Panty Supervisor wrote:Lilly must have been using the boys' bathroom to take a shower.

You know, I noticed this too but I thought it was a plothole at the time so I didn't think more about it. Oh Kenji, what a lovely start of the uprising it would have been.

Nyarly wrote:Cliche is probably also the reason why she got many suitors even in her old school. Which was an all-girls one. Well, that fits to her name...

Ah, I forgot about it being all-girls at that point in time. Thanks for bringing this up. Haha.

alabaster wrote:Just...not more KS. It's like when somebody makes a sequel to your favorite film even though the original ended on the perfect note to begin with.

A sequel, as in a story of what happens after the good ends? Yeah, don't want that. Heck, I haven't yet brought myself to finish KS after the first three paths I played. But with visual novels, you don't have to do a sequel. You can do extension packs, additional paths, or play as a different protagonist, etc. If done well, it can be a good bonus, perhaps surpass the original. If the devs had wanted to expand on the universe, sure. It's more that it would be unfair to demand more unpaid hard work and drama - they deserve to move on. Maybe it'll be a bit like the Touhou universe - a bit of official work, tons of fan art.

Guest wrote:So earlier on someone made a comment that they did not feel Lilly grew as a character during her story. (...)

Guest Poster wrote:A good way to describe Lilly would be "pleasant but subtly distant".

Kudos for these two guest posts.

Irandrura wrote:I actually responded to the ending not with tears, but with a sort of determined panic. My reaction was: "No. No. No, this is not allowed to happen. These two people are not allowed to split up. If she leaves I swear I am going to make Hisao fly to Scotland and learn English and live there, because break-up is not acceptable."

Brofist.jpg
Take Misha's hair and drill through the Earth's mantle if you have to man. Just get there. We have Japanese exchange students here in Europe, how hard can it be? Heck working at a fish farm or something. Anything, man! Might have led to an awkward situation if they ended up breaking up anyway, but at least that would be better than the neutral end.

Terrato wrote:but if it just so happens that this can't be changed, then i guess i mine as well be part woman (emotionally)

I wish to be the little girl, basically, but I didn't cry as one. I giggled as one.

Jailbot wrote:The worst part is that I can't even discuss it in real life because everyone I associate with dismisses it as a "hentai game where you take advantage of cripples" when it really isn't and it really pisses me off because it's so much more.

Well this is kind of inescapable. It is like the whole premise of the project, but it's played so straight that it has surpassed its origins.
And this sort of reaction also will come along when other entertainment involving disabled people comes along. The Norwegian version of "Beyond Boundaries" ("Ingen grenser") got accused of being cripplesploitation by some at first, but it ended up being a huge success, and it doesn't exploit the participants in the least.
I don't know maybe try to point out that it's an erotic visual novel between disabled people - the protagonist is disabled too remember.

Just a small point somebody brought up: Yes, Lily was already "on the pill", but this isn't necessarily because she was expecting to sleep with Hisao. She could simply have been using it to regulate her period. When he forgot to take his pills, her feelings came to the surface and after confessing, the feelings of love and shared experience helped unleash her healthy adolescent sex drive.

So I have only completed Lily, Hanako, and Shizune routes, but I feel like Lily's was the only true "love story". Hanako's route was awkward for me to complete due to the pseudo-rape and the fact that she acts more like a child than a woman. Shizune's route felt like it was more about Shizune and Misha and Hisao was just "along for the ride". So yeah, nothing has even come close to Lily's route for me yet. I'll see if I feel differently after Emi and Rin, though I suspect not.

eklektik wrote:Would any of you actually date someone who commonly uses the phrase "My, my"?

Absolutely. I actually found her formal way of speech - and especially that phrase - very cute.

dunkelfalke wrote:

eklektik wrote:Would any of you actually date someone who commonly uses the phrase "My, my"?

Absolutely. I actually found her formal way of speech - and especially that phrase - very cute.

Ahla, Ahla.

newnar wrote:

dunkelfalke wrote:

eklektik wrote:Would any of you actually date someone who commonly uses the phrase "My, my"?

Absolutely. I actually found her formal way of speech - and especially that phrase - very cute.

Ahla, Ahla.

Ara, ara*

Seems I'm jumping on this bandwagon pretty late But, want to share my thoughts anyhow. I rated Lilly's route a '4'. It was very good, but not the best for me. Maybe, love-wise it was the best path, because she's a very warm and caring person and when I heard the music-box play in the end I had one of my KS-moments, but still... I think the other girls' issues are way, way bigger and as such their respective paths were much more rewarding for me, which makes them more 'favorite' than Lilly's route.

I've completed 4 routes so far and Lilly's is by far the best.

When Hisao is in the hospital and the music box music starts playing, ALL MY FEELS. The neutral ending should have ended on the scene before that (where Hisao's lying in the hospital bed going "welp, I fucked that up"), now that I think about it, for that extra knife twist.

U.T. Raptor wrote:The neutral ending should have ended on the scene before that (where Hisao's lying in the hospital bed going "welp, I fucked that up"), now that I think about it, for that extra knife twist.

Yes, absolutely yes.

I simply can not understand why the neutral ending ended when it did. The woman Hisao is in love with is leaving forever and he can't muster as much as a "Please, don't go"?

Bullshit, I say. That scene of him making a mad dash to the airport and in the hospital afterwards were the perfect way to end Lilly's arc. Letting it stop as soon as she leaves Yamaku is horribly unsatisfying and makes Hisao look like a spineless twerp. If he's not willing to fight for her, then he probably doesn't deserve her.

But then the Good Ending comes and makes the entire arc feel complete in the best way possible. This is only my second completed route (Emi being my first), and I can't wait to see if this one can be topped.