Katawa Shoujo Forums

Elessar wrote:Well, Zarys has a point though.
I shouldn't only be concerned about my feelings, what if it's even harder for her?
I invited her to my concert tomorrow, if she is there i'll go and talk to her, if not, well i might try and text her one more time, just to be 100% sure that i can move on

That's good mate. You shouldn't just give up, living with uncertainty is choking (I'm talking from experience) and one of the worst feeling you can live with. Be sure before moving on.
Pulling a Hanako's Good Ending (and by that I mean doing your part) was a good decision. Best of luck to you mate!

LordMarluxia wrote: That's good mate. You shouldn't just give up, living with uncertainty is choking (I'm talking from experience) and one of the worst feeling you can live with. Be sure before moving on.
Pulling a Hanako's Good Ending (and by that I mean doing your part) was a good decision. Best of luck to you mate!

Thanks man, gonna need a lot of thinking now to find the right words, but i will do my very best, i promise!

You came to the interenet for relationship advice, and relationship advice you shall recieve.

You're on the right track. Showing up at her house may have been a bit too much, so you were right there.

When I broke up with my first girlfriend, it was due to a couple of simple words she said. (there were things before that, but it was the last straw) I later responded, "The admittance of a probability makes it infinitely more likely." If you start to give up on her now, you will be more emotionally prepared for her to reject you or simply not be ready for you. If you don't, however, your mind will try harder to "make it work," which has a couple of positive and negative side-effects.

It was a good idea to invite her to a concert and let that be the final event, although judging by your description of her, something less public might've been appropriate. (Concerts tend to be loud and crowded.) I'd suggest rather than a last text, try calling her and leaving a message explaining that you'd like to date/hang out sometime. That way, she can hear your voice, and get the message. If she does pick up however, you'll have a chance to converse with her.

Hope it works out on your end either way. Stuff like that is hard.

P.S: Jeez it's like Zarys thought you were actually dating Hanako.

Elessar wrote:Well, Zarys has a point though.
I shouldn't only be concerned about my feelings, what if it's even harder for her?
I invited her to my concert tomorrow, if she is there i'll go and talk to her, if not, well i might try and text her one more time, just to be 100% sure that i can move on

Ah! at least you let her a chance to take an initiative instead of "deciding" for her.
Believe me, in relationships, what you do don't cause long regrets, but what you don't do, yes.

Broomhead wrote: P.S: Jeez it's like Zarys thought you were actually dating Hanako.

Obviously I knows she is not Hanako, but some things in Hanako are just based on the real-life and are so true. (Especially the fact to don't underestimate what people liker her may feel, don't take always shyness for disinterest, dare ask what she really feels, she is an human being too and he is not less unable to wants what she wants than you and have the right to say it, not a broken doll who would dies if you dare to interact with)
I just think that "don't try anything" is an awfull advice. .
But yes, having diplomacy is a good thing. (I did not mention how to do it, I don't pretend to know this) but TRY is a principle to have any chance.

azumeow wrote:

LordMarluxia wrote:What the fuck happened to Zarys... he sounds like a rabid lover in heat.

Lilly ending must have caused a great effect on him.

Hilariously enough, I just went through a Lilly neutral end with my ex. She's down in florida for college, and we still talk, but...that ship has sailed. It's unfortunate, but to be fair it wasn't gonna go all that far. We'd already broken up for unrelated reasons, and frankly, it's fine. She wasn't gonna stick around no matter what (she's at the point where she wants to be FAR away from her family) so frankly I just accepted it. Not like I'll never see her or talk to her again or anything.

I'm not completly idealist, sometimes it don't works and it's all (especialy that the relation don't works even withtout this separation), but yes I hate all these opinions of stopping with the first difficulty (and after speaking of "puppy love" by rationalizing)







...And I don't have the feel to be the morron one when i'm the ONLY ONE for being concerned about what she can feels too. (If she can be in the same situation that him for example,ect...that try is certainly better for him AND her even in the case where she would don't likes him,ect...)

LordMarluxia wrote:
Also, you kind of just spoiler Lilly's normal ending. I haven't finished Lilly's route yet. I'm at the restaurant scene at the moment.

Shit, I did do that.

Shit. I'm sorry, dude. I didn't even think about that. I shall go toil in the mines as punishment for my sins, for they are great.

Zarys wrote:NO, DO IT FOR HER ! AT LEAST TRY !
SHUT UP, STUPID COWARDS, DON'T TURNS THE OTHERS INTO LOSERS LIKE YOU THAT TRY NOTHING AND WONDER WHY NOTHING WORKS IN THEIR LIFEBY GIVING THIS KIND OF STUPID ADVICE.

He's already contacted her twice and been ignored twice. Combine that with not really being sure if he likes her that much and it is time to move on with his life.

I said just to try a little more because there is nothing to lose.
And how you knows what she thinks ? you are a psychic ?
I don't know, maybe you would be more tolerant before jumping to conclusions ?

I don't know if it's just me, but I'm getting a vibe that Zarys is not a reliable source of relationship advice.

Zarys wrote:I said just to try a little more because there is nothing to lose.
I don't know, maybe you would be more tolerant before jumping to conclusions ?

What is your guideline for how long you should continue harassing someone who isn't interested and/or has cut contact? Is it when they call the police?

And how you knows what she thinks ? you are a psychic ?

I would say I probably have more experience, but anecdotal evidence isn't allowed here.

The real world is not a romance novel, and if someone isn't responding to your messages, that's a sign that you should cease contact (unless you had other agreements in place in that situation). If they want to get back in touch with you, they'll do that on their own time.

Trying to contact someone who doesn't want to be contacted repeatedly is a good way to make oneself persona non grata.

To steal from KS... look at what happens when Hisao doesn't leave Hanako or Emi alone when they want to be left alone.

HarvestmanMan wrote:I don't know if it's just me, but I'm getting a vibe that Zarys is not a reliable source of relationship advice.

I argued why I thought my advice was good, question the reliability of the one who said it is just mean, and I'm curious of your reasons for it.
If you contest my opinion, find a good reason inherent to my advice, not an ad hominem attack, please.

metalangel wrote: What is your guideline for how long you should continue harassing someone who isn't interested and/or has cut contact? Is it when they call the police?

This is a ridiculous comparison, and it is mentioned that she is shy, so maybe she hesitates and only contact her again one or twice might be a good idea ? or his idea of a invitation, at worst, she will no come or never answer...Yeah i'm sure that she will dies from anxiety.

metalangel wrote: I would say I probably have more experience, but anecdotal evidence isn't allowed here.

You don't knows me, and why I am the only one here who is contested ? because I have a different opinion that the majority here ?

bhtooefr wrote:The real world is not a romance novel...To steal from KS... look at what happens when Hisao doesn't leave Hanako or Emi alone when they want to be left alone.

Yeah of course, If i have a another opinion that you, I'm necessarily delusive.

And against, I don't encourage him to break and enter in her house...

Zarys wrote:
This is a ridiculous comparison, and it is mentioned that she is shy, so maybe she hesitates and only contact her again one or twice might be a good idea ? or the his idea of a invitation, at worst, she will no come or never answer...Yeah i'm sure that she will dies from anxiety.

As a person with shyness and introversion, repeated unsolicited contact from someone I didn't like and didn't want to talk to would FREAK ME THE HELL OUT. If someone is suitably freaked, they might well notify the police so there is a record in case something else happens. I've seen this happen IRL.

I am still not seeing how a third message will get her to respond where a first or second didn't.

You don't knows me, and why I am the only one here who is contested ? because I have a different opinion that the majority here ?

That and you called us all losers for not agreeing with your borderline socially unacceptable and potentially distressing course of action.

I was annoyed by so much defeatism, it's all, I have the impression of having seen more cowardice than rationalism.
But I'm glad that at least you argue correctly now. (Even if idealy we must just give our opinion and let's the freewil of Elessar choose if he want to follow one of us), but he has already proved that she liked at first, how do you know if she likes him but does not dare ? it will not be better to clarify by a last ultimatum, a least opportunity for her ? why not believe in her ability to be an adult ?
So as a person with shyness and introversion, you like not being taken seriously ? you would like us to believe that you are unable to exprim a simple choice ?
You will dies if I ask you as a normal human being who have the right of choices ? if a girl do the same with yo maybe it would be hard for you, but you would not dies ant it would be better for everyone; and yes I think that this hypotical girl would have the right to don't spare you for don't remain in uncertainty, and if you would put her feelings beneath your anxiety, sorry but I think that in addition to think that people without social anxiety cannot have legitimate pain compared to people with social anxiety, you would be selfish.
(And if I act like you, i would accuse you to never lives the situation described by Elessar so much as him as her but as like you I have any proofs, so I don't)
Sorry but I think it's better to suppose that introverted or not, she is still a decent human being who merit to be a minimum trusted in her capacities.

And I ask you to don't accuse me of being borderline, and how it is socially unacceptable to send messages or exige a clarification about it ? I prefer treat someone like an human being than being "socialy acceptable".

And again, respect the freewil of Elessar : He have choose to trust me. (And I was certainly the only one to really trust him and her)

Zarys, there is a language barrier here so I apologise if I am misunderstanding anything in that last post.

Your suggestion is on the borderline of being socially unacceptable. Everyone has a right to peaceful enjoyment of their lives, and repeated unsolicited or unwanted intrusions do constitute harassment, which is illegal. If you attempt contact multiple times and get no response, you have to accept that as a message in itself, that the other party does not want to engage with you. Stalkers, debt collectors, salespeople and others all know their odds of getting what they want from you is exponentially higher if you respond to them.

It is not defeatist to come to terms with the fact that someone just isn't that into you. You have another person here, not some physical obstacle you're trying to surmount. You'll never ride your bike up that steep hill? That's defeatist. I love you but you don't want anything to do with me? Respect their decision and move on. Someone you have to pester like that doesn't want to be with you and will not be enjoying themselves if you try to coerce them.

One thing I'll note about my comments about the real world not being a romance novel... much romance-oriented media perpetuates this meme that a "good guy" deserves to be with a woman, and with enough persistence, the woman will "realize" that she's "actually in love" with him.

This is an extremely toxic attitude, and that is what is not part of the real world. KS is actually good about deconstructing some of those tropes, and sometimes quite painfully so, as in Misstep. OK, it's not exactly the same thing, but there's this same meme of persistence that Hisao follows, and it ends badly.

In the real world, this attitude that someone is entitled to be with a woman can be read from miles away, and many women treat that as a danger sign, because that attitude results in some behaviors that can potentially be a threat to the woman's very life. For instance, if someone feels that they're entitled to being with a woman, how far will they go to ensure that they get that? Sure, you might say that Elessar wouldn't physically harm her... but if you were in her shoes, where he's repeatedly trying to get in contact with her when she's obviously not responding for some reason, and she's in a position in society where she very well could get raped (and if she doesn't "do everything right", society will blame her for it, too), would you trust that?

(I'm not actually saying that Elessar would harm her in any way, but how is she to know that? And, for all we know, something like that could have happened to her in the past, and that could be part of why she's so withdrawn.)

And, anxiety issues can make communicating all of this very difficult, too. She may well be at DEFCON 1 and freaking out about how he won't leave her alone, for all we know, and hoping he just goes away. Or, she may want to interact with him, but be overwhelmed by everything, and she needs some time and space to get through it. We don't know this, and Elessar doesn't know this. But, the best course of action is to, unless she specifically requested otherwise, give her space, and let her make contact on her own terms. If she doesn't make contact, then move on. Actually, not a bad idea to move on anyway, getting fixated on one person isn't healthy unless you're engaged to them or married to them.