Oh Lilly... what's wrong with me?

[YZQ]

Well, to me, she's good for hanging out, along with Emi. I personally would put Rin and Shizune further down the list. Hanako is such a wild card that I don't know where to rank her. At least, I probably confuse Rin as much as she confuses me.

[Markus Ramikin]

Gotta say I share the sentiment about the "betrayal". I actually like Lilly a great deal for all the other reasons, to the extent that she's pretty much my favourite girl depending on what day you ask me. And most of the OP's objections are actually positives in my eyes (so the girl likes sex. What on Earth is wrong with that, either in real life terms or in storytelling terms?). But if I were in Hisao's place, and had a wtf like that happen to me - learning that she'd been pretty much deceiving me from the start of our relationship - I'd probably not be able to generate the enthusiasm to persuade Lilly to stay afterwards. I wouldn't be able to honestly tell her that I'm 100% sure that I want her to.

I wonder if KS authors expected this to make her seem unsympathetic when they made her do that, or that players would find it utterly forgivable.

[Mirage_GSM]

I wonder if KS authors expected this to make her seem unsympathetic when they made her do that, or that players would find it utterly forgivable.

Actually, that's an interesting question.
Let's see if Suriko is inclined to answer it.

[Guest Poster]

I find it interesting no one is pointing out how similar Lilly and Hisao are. The arc is as much about him as it is about her imo.

I kind of disagree there.

I mean, both basically live their lives allowing their condition and others to dictate how they live (Hisao after it happens).

Hisao's condition is pretty much dominating his life when Act 1 starts, but that's not at all the case for Lilly. She's always been blind and is comfortable with her handicap. Completely unlike Hisao.

Lilly is sent away due to her condition, and by the will of her parents.

It's kind of difficult to determine the exact reason Lilly's parents didn't take her along to Scotland. We only have two accounts; Lilly's and Akira's. Neither is completely objective on the subject.

Hisao has the exact same thing happen to him. Hisao doesn't want people to pity him for his condition, despite needing help at times, and Lilly is the same way (although she's had it long enough to accept there are things she needs help with).

That's true, but that's not unique to Hisao and Lilly. Each girl you can end up with dislikes being pitied. Some are just more vocal about it than others.

Both are largely independent due to not seeing their parents often, both had some sort of crush they weren't able to be with, Hisao because his condition and Lilly because her status. Lilly and Hisao's discussion about their past loves also serves as some good foreshadowing, with Lilly revealing she just sort of did nothing last time and Hisao revealing he he was going to do something but was stopped short of his condition. And as it turns out, Lilly does the same thing this time (not pursuing her love), but Hisao pursues his, in spite of his condition.

That is somewhat of a good point.

But more importantly, they never protested. Throughout there lives they just did what was asked of them. Move here, follow these instructions, etc, etc, never revealing or pursuing what they really wanted to do. I doubt Lilly wanted to move away from her parents, and we know Hisao didn't (although he never openly protested to them). They both just accepted what was happening to them.

It's kind of different. Hisao's not happy he's being sent to Yamaku, but ultimately realizes his parents have a point and begrudgedly accepts. You have to remember that Japanese views on parental authority are different from western ones. This is particularly evident in Lilly's case. (she's the only girl who acts like a blatantly obvious Japanese)

Even with Lilly, Hisao just follows along. He always lets her take the intuitive, and never puts in to much thought behind what he actually wants to do at any given time. I don't think Lilly leaving was any sort of test, and I don't think Lilly didn't tell Hisao earlier because she was hiding it. Lilly leaving was just her going through the motions, as she had always done. Even if she "thought" it over, the truth is she was looking at it objectively, without any concern for her actual feelings. Lilly not telling Hisao was because Hisao had never once shown any interest in making any sort of decision, instead leaving it to Lilly. Naturally, Lilly's decision to move away would fall into this, so why should she expect him to input on that decision when he never had input on any others? As it turns out, she's right, as he just sort of accepts her decision without any input of his own once he is told.

Kind of different circumstances. Hisao's indecisive and passive because of his condition. Lilly's independant and in control of her life and doesn't really think much of her blindness. She doesn't cling to others the same way Hisao does and is actually a pillar of support for others. The reason she becomes indecisive later is due to her parents' summoning, not due to insecurity about her own condition. Normally, Lilly knows exactly what she wants out of life and doesn't let other people guide her or drag her into things. (as evident by her spats with Shizune) She doesn't even cling to Akira anymore...the latter's no longer a semi-parental figure and more of a friend to exchange teasing banter with.

If there's a girl Hisao's similar to, I'd say it's Hanako. Both used to be "normal", suddenly had something happen to them that left their life in shambles and let their condition define who they are. Both were abandoned by their friends. (Hanako in a more cruel way than Hisao) Both ended up cynical because of it. Both turned to reading in order to pass the time they spent alone. Both like to play games and are playfully (but not forcefully) competitive. Both are rather introverted, but will snap when pushed too far. Both end up being dragged into a club at one point or another. And if you pick a certain option, both end up tossing someone out of their room once they feel cornered. Oh, and they have the same telephone model.

I wonder if KS authors expected this to make her seem unsympathetic when they made her do that, or that players would find it utterly forgivable.

I think the authors simply intended to deconstruct the 'Japanese beauty' type. KS is good at turning around traits people are attracted to and make them realize those traits have downsides.

Emi: Do you like a girl who won't let something like the loss of her legs get her down and stubbornly keeps going and going and going until she feels fine again? Well, unfortunately she also uses this tactic to leave you in the dust once your relationship hits a bump.

Rin: Do you like a girl who makes funny remarks out of the blue? Let's see you enjoy it when she's like that 24/7.

Hanako: Do you like a girl who's adorably shy and with whom you can feel good as she clings to you? Well, she hates that attitude and she'll hate you if she suspects that to be your train of thought.

Lilly: Do you like a girl who acts like a traditional Japanese? The one who's always polite, always friendly, always has a smile and is a good homemaker? Well, the same culture that teaches them to act this way centers around avoiding conflicts at any costs, teaches people to be reserved with their private thoughts even around friends, encourages suffering in silence instead of 'bothering others with problems' and demands absolute obedience to authority figures, whether they're right or wrong. Double-edged knife. Little sidenote; if someone who's been taught her entire life to defer to authority figures tells her parents she's following her own dreams, that's a really big deal. I'd probably forgive her.

The message is basically; take the good and the bad together or take neither.

[Xanatos]

Never cared for Lilly much the whole betrayal thing for no reason irked me. However I see why people liked it.

What betrayal?

I don't know about you but not telling your loved one that you're fucking off half the world away is betrayal.

But she did tell him...

Guest Poster's basically nailed it. Every girl is a subversion and a bit of a "fuck you" to the things you like by showing off the lousy part of those things.

[MegaMoto]

What betrayal?[/quote]
I don't know about you but not telling your loved one that you're fucking off half the world away is betrayal.[/quote]

But she did tell him...

Guest Poster's basically nailed it. Every girl is a subversion and a bit of a "fuck you" to the things you like by showing off the lousy part of those things. [/quote]
The ting that bothered me is that she waited til the last minute letting you belive everything is fine even though she knew for months. MOTHER FUCKING MONTHS !

[Steinherz]

The ting that bothered me is that she waited til the last minute letting you belive everything is fine even though she knew for months. MOTHER FUCKING MONTHS !

She's probably going off the whole "Japanese don't like hearing/giving bad news" stereotype. Hence why she didn't tell him, or she didn't want him to be depressed... again

[MegaMoto]

The ting that bothered me is that she waited til the last minute letting you belive everything is fine even though she knew for months. MOTHER FUCKING MONTHS !

She's probably going off the whole "Japanese don't like hearing/giving bad news" stereotype. Hence why she didn't tell him, or she didn't want him to be depressed... again

That is actually the best reasoning in awhile.

[Xanatos]

The ting that bothered me is that she waited til the last minute letting you belive everything is fine even though she knew for months. MOTHER FUCKING MONTHS !

The guy's been a depressed little fleshsack from the moment he arrived. I wouldn't wanna pile on either.

[MegaMoto]

The ting that bothered me is that she waited til the last minute letting you belive everything is fine even though she knew for months. MOTHER FUCKING MONTHS !

The guy's been a depressed little fleshsack from the moment he arrived. I wouldn't wanna pile on either.

But having your girlfriend just disappear without telling you is better for you depression.

[pandaphil]

The ting that bothered me is that she waited til the last minute letting you belive everything is fine even though she knew for months. MOTHER FUCKING MONTHS !

She's probably going off the whole "Japanese don't like hearing/giving bad news" stereotype. Hence why she didn't tell him, or she didn't want him to be depressed... again

That makes a lot of sense really. She wanted them to enjoy the time they had together rather than him spending the time being sad, or counting down the days til she left over a period of months.

Personally I'm willing to forgive her. As adult as she tries to act, shes still just a teenager, and prone to making dumb decisions sometimes.

And at least she makes the right decision in the (good) end.

[Xanatos]

The ting that bothered me is that she waited til the last minute letting you belive everything is fine even though she knew for months. MOTHER FUCKING MONTHS !

The guy's been a depressed little fleshsack from the moment he arrived. I wouldn't wanna pile on either.

But having your girlfriend just disappear without telling you is better for you depression.

No, you'd just think she's a total bitch on top of the depression.

[MegaMoto]

"

The guy's been a depressed little fleshsack from the moment he arrived. I wouldn't wanna pile on either.

But having your girlfriend just disappear without telling you is better for you depression.

No, you'd just think she's a total bitch on top of the depression.

You make a compelling argument.

[pandaphil]

No, you'd just think she's a total bitch on top of the depression.

Maybe she feels it would be worth it if it would help him get over her and move on faster.

Its possible that all this is some misguided attempt to punish herself. I've read that its pretty common for children who are sent away, or who's parents separate to blame themselves for what happened. It does seem kind of odd that she never has a negative word to say about her folks.

[Guest Poster]

It does seem kind of odd that she never has a negative word to say about her folks.

I don't think it is. It fits in well with the confucian moral code that Lilly probably grew up with or was at least taught in her previous school(s). Part of that is absolute loyalty to parental figures. Another part of it is to never speak ill about them to anyone who isn't part of the family. It's a big social no-no.