Katawa Shoujo Forums

ravenlord wrote:Discussions like this really should be in fan fiction. There you can be Yamaku's armchair psychiatrist and diagnose Lilly with a chemical dependency disorder and sex addiction, Emi with sexual deviant nymphomaniac syndrome, Misha as a lesbian stalker with an obesity condition, Shizune as a soulless psychopath and rapist, Hanako as a sociopath with PTSD, and Rin as an autistic channeler of grey aliens.

We've seen it all on the main page and it always erupts in a flame war due to being very trollish and highly exploitable. There are subforums for a reason. Please take this crazy stuff there, and speculate to your heart's content.

Okay, you say that the discussion can be trollish immediately after you try to shoot down what were actually valid arguments against your claim that Yamaku explicitly refuses admission to anyone with a mental disorder (That is seriously how you've been phrasing it) with a strawman argument. C'mon, that's shit i'd expect from a YouTube troll who doesn't know the shift key exists, not someone on a forum for a visual novel.

Pyramid Head wrote:Okay, you say that the discussion can be trollish immediately after you try to shoot down what were actually valid arguments against your claim that Yamaku explicitly refuses admission to anyone with a mental disorder (That is seriously how you've been phrasing it) with a strawman argument. C'mon, that's shit i'd expect from a YouTube troll who doesn't know the shift key exists, not someone on a forum for a visual novel.

Act 2: Past, Scene 3: Presents and Presence wrote:Hideaki: "Akira told me. Being a Yamaku student, I suppose you're disabled in some way?"

Hisao: "Not everyone in Yamaku's disabled…"

Which I only learned a handful of days ago. I give silent thanks to Shizune and Misha for their stream of information about how the school works.
Because of them, I found out that since the school will accept practically anybody suffering from non-mental disabilities, it doesn't discriminate against healthy people either.

My interpretation of "non-mental disabilities" extends to dangerous or crippling neuroses and (severe) learning disabilities.

It would be impossible to diagnose Rin with Aspergers. Because she's a fictional character, and we only see a small cross-section of her life from a single individual's viewpoint. Not that anyone would care about that detail...

On principle, I oppose armchair diagnoses, especially when it comes to behavioral disorders. Someone who's a neat freak is diagnosed as OCD. Someone who has trust issues is diagnosed as paranoid. Someone who deviates from the norm socially and/or has difficulty fitting in is diagnosed with Aspergers (or autism in general).

You'd expect the kind of people who play a cripple porn game (i.e., geeks) to be a little less likely to claim that someone who acts a little different from the mainstream must have something wrong with his head...

From personal experience, I know that she is nowhere near any significant degree of Aspergers. But does she have "a slight case?"

I would say no.

She doesn't have any issue understanding people. Hisao concerns her, but that's because Hisao tends to act in a very concerning manner. Rin has trouble being understood. Without arms, her body language is, well, foreign. When it comes to words, she tends to overthink them, because the words she grasps for don't fit quite right. She often takes the literal interpretation of words and has a fixation on the precise meaning of words.

She doesn't act awkward because she doesn't understand how to act. She acts awkward because she knows that people tend to not understand her, so she overcompensates, which only makes it harder to understand her. Don't believe me? Look at the endings. She makes a whole lot more sense when she stops caring about being understood, doesn't she?

ProfAllister wrote:

Pyramid Head wrote:Okay, you say that the discussion can be trollish immediately after you try to shoot down what were actually valid arguments against your claim that Yamaku explicitly refuses admission to anyone with a mental disorder (That is seriously how you've been phrasing it) with a strawman argument. C'mon, that's shit i'd expect from a YouTube troll who doesn't know the shift key exists, not someone on a forum for a visual novel.

Act 2: Past, Scene 3: Presents and Presence wrote:Hideaki: "Akira told me. Being a Yamaku student, I suppose you're disabled in some way?"

Hisao: "Not everyone in Yamaku's disabled…"

Which I only learned a handful of days ago. I give silent thanks to Shizune and Misha for their stream of information about how the school works.
Because of them, I found out that since the school will accept practically anybody suffering from non-mental disabilities, it doesn't discriminate against healthy people either.

(Logical argument I had to snip due to length)

It seems you are assuming I don't know the criteria for Asperger's or OCD. Which is false, as I've done research on both, the former because I have it and the latter because I was bored and like to learn about psychology. I know that being socially awkward isn't the sole criteria for Asperger's just as well as I know that being a neat freak doesn't make you OCD. You could say I'm an amateur psychologist, though I have a quite a bit to go before I'm of much credit, to be honest.

Aspie syndrome (offhand cuz I'm sick of typing the whole name out ) affects each individual differently. But, the main criteria is that you basically aren't born with inborn social rules. It does not mean you are a social flop, as they are 2 different things, though often can go hand in hand. Making a bad joke isn't a potential sign of an aspie. Making an offensive joke but not realising it, and then wondering why everyone's angry, is one, especially if it's repeated. Which, one could say Rin's "in your pants" joke was an example of the latter.

Also, on the whole "Rin understands people fine, people don't understand her" argument, you do have a point. However, I can say from personal experience that it's easy as pie to understand what nuero-typical people are talking about usually, but hard to put your own words out. Mostly because over time you learn how to understand people, but it's harder to learn how to communicate yourself. Sorta like how it's easier to learn how to understand and read a new language, but another thing to try and speak it.

I must give you a point though on the body language thing. Even a "normal" person would be stunted in body language if they had no way of doing it themselves.

Personally, I'm not saying Rin has definitive Asperger's, I just found it interesting that she had many qualities of an aspie and wanted to point it out. Make of it what you will, I guess.

On a side note, anyone else having fun? Logical debates are one of my favorite past-times, especially with smart people like the people in this thread, and I'm surprised I was able to start one. :3

jumjummju wrote:On a side note, anyone else having fun? Logical debates are one of my favorite past-times, especially with smart people like the people in this thread, and I'm surprised I was able to start one. :3

There are some people here capable of having intelligent conversation, and generally patient enough to repeat themselves.

For future reference, though, I'd recommend you use the "Search" feature to see if your topic has been discussed before. And read the whole thread if/when you find your topic mentioned. If you still feel you have something to contribute, the general rule seems to be in favor of resurrecting the old thread rather than making a new one.

I didn't really get an aspie impression of her. I have a theory that the medication that fucked up her arms during birth or pregnancy or whatever, may also have fucked up her brain chemistry or something.
But it's pointless to try and diagnose a character like Rin. She just has a peculiar personality, just like some trees grow larger than all the others, her personality grew weirder. She's the most intriguing character in KS IMO

Kadadj wrote:I have a theory that the medication that fucked up her arms during birth or pregnancy or whatever, may also have fucked up her brain chemistry or something.

Strictly, speaking, Rin being a Thalidomide baby isn't canon. It was one of RAITA's notes on the original image, but I believe the devs said they discarded that idea.

That being said, the devs have also said that anything outside the official materials (i.e., website and game) isn't canon, even if it's Word of God (WARNING: TV Tropes Link!).

Thalidomide usage during pregnancy can result in crippled or absent limbs on birth. It can also cause mental retardation. And it was used as a treatment for morning sickness for some time. But I believe use was pretty solidly discontinued int he '50s, if memory serves. The "official" (non-canon) story is that Rin just happened to be born with deformed arms that were amputated at birth.

So take that for what it's worth.

ProfAllister wrote:

Kadadj wrote:I have a theory that the medication that fucked up her arms during birth or pregnancy or whatever, may also have fucked up her brain chemistry or something.

Strictly, speaking, Rin being a Thalidomide baby isn't canon. It was one of RAITA's notes on the original image, but I believe the devs said they discarded that idea.

That being said, the devs have also said that anything outside the official materials (i.e., website and game) isn't canon, even if it's Word of God (WARNING: TV Tropes Link!).

Thalidomide usage during pregnancy can result in crippled or absent limbs on birth. It can also cause mental retardation. And it was used as a treatment for morning sickness for some time. But I believe use was pretty solidly discontinued int he '50s, if memory serves. The "official" (non-canon) story is that Rin just happened to be born with deformed arms that were amputated at birth.

So take that for what it's worth.

Oh, OK then, sorry about that. I guess I'll just consider her special from now on. I'm very interested in psychology, and I have read a lot about it, but mainly about shit like anxiety and depression. If Rin were to see a therapist, I'm sure he could pin a lot of diagnoses on her, but I prefer just to view her as peculiar, or eccentric. Also, growing up without arms is deemed to have consequences on your cognitive functioning.

Whether the OP is right or wrong about Rin's 'condition', I just see her as Rin. She's not incredibly hard to understand, and I don't really want to believe that all of that character and charisma is the result of a diagnosed mental disability rather than just her true self.

ShadeHaven wrote:Whether the OP is right or wrong about Rin's 'condition', I just see her as Rin. She's not incredibly hard to understand, and I don't really want to believe that all of that character and charisma is the result of a diagnosed mental disability rather than just her true self.

I agree with you. I use the word "Rin-ish" instead of "mild case of Asperger's".