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I like Shizune's route, probably one of my favorites behind Lilly and Emi, but it didn't feel like it was particularly emotional, even if the writing was good.

Her route seemed more like a "friends with benefits" type of deal more than any type of genuine romance. The only two sentences uttered in her route that seem to be going in that direction feel forced and thrown in just to appease someone. Out of the blue Hisao just seems to say "hey, how about we start dating?" and then after a simple "okay" from Shizune nothing really changes, even at the very end when he says "I love you", out of the blue again, no one even seems to care, Shizune doesn't even seem to notice it. Maybe it's just me but the lack of genuine romantic affection between the two for the most part and not really behaving like a couple all that much soured the experience for me somewhat.

Here comes the hate~

Okay, not really. But I wanted to like this route. But... God, it dragged on. The narrative hurt, the pacing hurt. Maybe having only one choice made it feel longer, but God damn. And Hisao acts more jackassy in this route than in the others, but whatever. It can't be helped.

To be more precise:

1. Jigoro. He felt like a joke character. The subplot behind Shizune's family, her refusal to communicate with them, her father's desire to make her 'normal'- these would have been a lot heavier hitting if Jigoro seemed like a normal if stern guy. I mean, take Nomiya- he's sort of out there and obnoxious, but he's still anchored to reality. Kenji's comic relief never comes into direct influence with the plot. Jigoro just feels like meme bait.

2. Hideaki. I just... I just don't know. Was the bow necessary? I mean really?

3. Misha. I know most of her "WAHAHA"-ness is just a facade, but even so, her constant "WAHA" and "~" crap made it just grating. She felt less like an actual person and more like comic relief, an ironic foil to a serious character. When it turns around and everything starts to get all serious, it just feels unnatural. While Shizune is her own character, Misha just feels like an extension of Shizune. Feels like she gets more characterization in the other routes, really.

4. Choices. As in, you only get one. This makes no sense to me. The way you earned Shizune's respect in Act 1 was by asserting yourself. Suddenly, in Act 2, you just let yourself be steamrolled. Felt jarring and... uncharacteristic. For loving games as she does, Shizune doesn't seem to challenge you much anymore.

5. The Student Council itself. A lot of the scenes just run "we went to the Student Council room. We worked. I went back to the dorm." I mean, what the hell do they do in there? You'd expect to see members of different clubs showing up with grievances, or even Shizune arguing with teachers about finances and stuff.

6. Implied romance. I'm fine with it, honestly, but if we're going to have scenes and scenes of Student Council work, you'd think there'd be something about Hisao and Shizune forming their own private shorthand, flirting with each other across the room, etc.

Don't get me wrong. The underlying story is solid, and it even ends on the everything-is-perfect happy ending (Hisao never stops hunting Shizune, after all). It just hurt to read.

Also, Hisao not sleeping in the Student Council room with Shizune after their second time together? Get the fuck outta here

Neon Vanguard wrote:1. Jigoro. He felt like a joke character. The subplot behind Shizune's family, her refusal to communicate with them, her father's desire to make her 'normal'- these would have been a lot heavier hitting if Jigoro seemed like a normal if stern guy. I mean, take Nomiya- he's sort of out there and obnoxious, but he's still anchored to reality. Kenji's comic relief never comes into direct influence with the plot. Jigoro just feels like meme bait.

His character kind of pissed me off, if Jigoro was meant as something of a comic relief it's poorly executed. I found myself just relentlessly clicking through any scenes with him, after the second obnoxious encounter I got sick of it.

Neon Vanguard wrote:Also, Hisao not sleeping in the Student Council room with Shizune after their second time together? Get the fuck outta here

I know what you mean... I couldn't believe that actually happened, one of the few genuine affectionate moments between the two and they just shrug it right off like it's nothing.

Neon Vanguard wrote:I wanted to like this route.

If you still want to like this route, I would deeply urge you to read this thread. A lot of very interesting viewpoints on how to approach this arc and analyze the characters' personalities and growths have been discussed by a number of members on this thread. I'm certain the things people have stated in this thread will radically change your opinions of Shizune's story.

I used to be a detractor of Shizune's arc in the same way you are now. After reading discussion here and in the other Shizune path thread, I personally can't wait to finish the two remaining arcs I have left so I can re-read Shizune.

I really enjoyed her route. She was the first route I played through (not counting Kenji, since I got his route first on accident), and I REALLY enjoyed it. I thought it was hilarious and touching, and I could sympathize with both Hisao and Shizune a lot (mostly because Shizune's personality is almost a carbon-copy of my wife's).

I didn't read anything else in this thread because I'm short on time right now, but I do intend to go through (someday) and read what others thought. =/

johiyo wrote:If you still want to like this route, I would deeply urge you to read this thread. A lot of very interesting viewpoints on how to approach this arc and analyze the characters' personalities and growths have been discussed by a number of members on this thread. I'm certain the things people have stated in this thread will radically change your opinions of Shizune's story.

Thank you

This is exactly what I intended to happen when I started the thread.

Neon Vanguard wrote:Don't get me wrong. The underlying story is solid, and it even ends on the everything-is-perfect happy ending (Hisao never stops hunting Shizune, after all). It just hurt to read.

Glad that you can at least see through what you dislike and appreciate what there is to enjoy

Perhaps the title of this thread is misleading, implying that I want everybody to fall in love with the route; it's more than enough to just have somebody articulate a well-reasoned opinion and express themselves logically. Always appreciate the contribution.

No, I enjoyed it too

Shizoon's route is like a two for one deal. Remember Hisao always saying Misha and Shizune are inseparable? Well that's how the story is. Hisao romances Shizune but has to try and keep him and the two girls close to each other instead of breaking up. For the people saying the relationship between Hisao and Shizune is like a friends with benefits type, remember that Shizune is very work oriented.

Also maybe it's implied that Shizune doesn't want to be so friendly *wink* with Hisao if Misha is there because of Misha's feelings for her. She does it when Misha is not around right~? Right~! Wahahaha.

Remember the end "three musketeers". That's what the story is.

Hisao was a pussy around Jigoro. I for one would not have talked in such a manner to such an epic dad. Disgraceful.

Titus wrote:No, I enjoyed it too

Shizoon's route is like a two for one deal. Remember Hisao always saying Misha and Shizune are inseparable? Well that's how the story is. Hisao romances Shizune but has to try and keep him and the two girls close to each other instead of breaking up. For the people saying the relationship between Hisao and Shizune is like a friends with benefits type, remember that Shizune is very work oriented.

Also maybe it's implied that Shizune doesn't want to be so friendly *wink* with Hisao if Misha is there because of Misha's feelings for her. She does it when Misha is not around right~? Right~! Wahahaha.

Remember the end "three musketeers". That's what the story is.

Yeah, Shizune is very work oriented. The Student Council is always going to be something that is going to come first for her. Combined with the fact that her deafness means that she is not used to communicating with people (esp hearing people) without an interprater means that she has a hard time wth realtionships in general. I have always thought of Shizune as a lonely rich kid, even before she was confirmed to be. She is not used to dealing with people so freindship is going to be hard for, let alone romantic love. That combined with the fact that she is conscious of Misha's feelings and doesn't want to hurt her any more than she has makes things awkward.

I also by into the theory posted here that Shizune is a variant on the "sunao cool" archetype. Though she hides her emotions behind her usual ultra competitive nature (though paradoxically she also uses it as a way of expressing it. I always interpreate Shizune's eagerness to play with Hisao as a way of flirting without flirting. ) And in times when Misha is not there she expresses her feeling in the most direct way she can, sex.

Her route is something you have engage with at an intellectual level to truely get. It not the wave of feels that say, Lilly and Hanako are, but it is good if you are willing to open your mind to it.

bradpara wrote:Her route is something you have engage with at an intellectual level to truely get. It not the wave of feels that say, Lilly and Hanako are, but it is good if you are willing to open your mind to it.

Precisely.

In a way, it's a bit like having a relationship when you spend a lot of time with your friends, or indeed in a shared house when you're a student. You don't get much privacy so when you do, you make the absolute most of it. IRL I've been in that situation and been glad of having a lockable door to my bedroom to stop Kenji or Rin-style housemates just walking in on us.

Oh i enjoyed it immensely. Though had i not visited this thread i believe i may have missed certain subtleties. Like many though it's hard to shake the feeling that it was more of a friends with benefits route then anything. The heavy focus on Misha and Shizune's family didn't help the matter at all. I think Shizune's family could have been cut entirelyin favor of more Shizune focus and that would have made it better.

Reading through this thread basically confirmed my vague thoughts after finishing the path. It's not that I don't like Shizune's as much because it isn't romantic, I don't like her's as much because it tries to shoehorn in romance/intimacy and fails. I think I would have loved it if it had just dropped the pretense and kept them as friends. Or at least had them realise once they started "dating" that it was just stilted and awkward.

I definitely liked the inclusion of the Misha drama, made her more three-dimensional in my eyes. Overall it felt more like a group story, and when it tried to do Shizune/Hisao romance it fell flat. The talk in this thread about Shizune's path helping Hisao grow up more was enjoyable, and helped me appreciate it a bit more, so cheers.

bradpara wrote:

Titus wrote:No, I enjoyed it too

Shizoon's route is like a two for one deal. Remember Hisao always saying Misha and Shizune are inseparable? Well that's how the story is. Hisao romances Shizune but has to try and keep him and the two girls close to each other instead of breaking up. For the people saying the relationship between Hisao and Shizune is like a friends with benefits type, remember that Shizune is very work oriented.

Also maybe it's implied that Shizune doesn't want to be so friendly *wink* with Hisao if Misha is there because of Misha's feelings for her. She does it when Misha is not around right~? Right~! Wahahaha.

Remember the end "three musketeers". That's what the story is.

Yeah, Shizune is very work oriented. The Student Council is always going to be something that is going to come first for her. Combined with the fact that her deafness means that she is not used to communicating with people (esp hearing people) without an interprater means that she has a hard time wth realtionships in general. I have always thought of Shizune as a lonely rich kid, even before she was confirmed to be. She is not used to dealing with people so freindship is going to be hard for, let alone romantic love. That combined with the fact that she is conscious of Misha's feelings and doesn't want to hurt her any more than she has makes things awkward.

I also by into the theory posted here that Shizune is a variant on the "sunao cool" archetype. Though she hides her emotions behind her usual ultra competitive nature (though paradoxically she also uses it as a way of expressing it. I always interpreate Shizune's eagerness to play with Hisao as a way of flirting without flirting. ) And in times when Misha is not there she expresses her feeling in the most direct way she can, sex.

Her route is something you have engage with at an intellectual level to truely get. It not the wave of feels that say, Lilly and Hanako are, but it is good if you are willing to open your mind to it.

Agreed. Hopefully it all works out for Hisao when he keeps chasing Shizune, after all, he can suffer a heart attack and die at any moment which would...hmm... devastate? or strongly hurt? Meh would be bad for Shizune and a bit for Misha.

I wonder, how would shizune and Misha handle Hisao's death?