Katawa Shoujo Forums

I think Emi was wonderfully written (even though it hurt). I almost think the author probably knew someone like her or went through a similar breakup.

megiddo wrote:I feel the same way. Emi was downright vicious in her bad end. That conversation at the track stung so much that her good ending (which I got after the bad end) didn't make sense. Her good ending was fake to me because I had seen her true self in the other end. Emi's bad end is her true end IMO.

She'll always be a bitch to me.

Well, that can be true. But haven't you thought of that Emi's being a bitch just because she's afraid of losing you? :/
And after a fight like that in the house, if you ran after her, it was kinda reasonable that she broke up with you.
And when you spoke to her on the track, she was cold... When she went back to running, she didn't look at you... maybe because she couldn't. What if she wanted to?
Plus, you (Hisao, I mean) were a f***ot as well.
I liked her so much, though. Her route was the first I got and after finishing, I was like... I couldn't think of anything else, but the story... So sad, and yet so cute. I loved it (and her as well )

Well, that can be true. But haven't you thought of that Emi's being a bitch just because she's afraid of losing you? :/

What, and... no.

And after a fight like that in the house, if you ran after her, it was kinda reasonable that she broke up with you. ... Plus, you (Hisao, I mean) were a f***ot as well.

Two things - one, no, it really wasn't that reasonable. She threw mixed signals at Hisao and then invited him to her mom's house, and IIRC wasn't it talk about her father that made her run off? Didn't make any sense that she'd invite a guy to have dinner with her mom when she knows he's wanting her to be his girlfriend for real, even though she told him she won't allow anyone to get close to her, and then to run away over something she really should have thought about ahead of time. ("Mom, I haven't told Hisao about Dad yet, can we avoid the subject please?" before the dinner. Or even during it.)

Second, that other line kinda throws me off. You realized you had to censor it but you couldn't just say something a bit less prejudical, like dumbass or douchebag? (And, no, he wasn't being a douche. She was jerking him around, not giving a damn about how he felt about it, while she tried to work herself out.)

And when you spoke to her on the track, she was cold... When she went back to running, she didn't look at you... maybe because she couldn't. What if she wanted to?

Are you kidding? She's the one who messed Hisao around, all he did was try to react to what-the-hell-subtext-is-all-of-this, and then she flatly breaks up with him for it. Granted, she at least had the decency to say "look, it's really not working" rather than "you're a jerk" or something, but from start to finish, she set the stage for what would happen. Hisao barely had any choice in the matter, and isn't able to speak the magical words to make things better without outside help. I have sympathy for the character in that she's clearly having a tough time in her head; I have no sympathy for her drawing someone else in close and then messing them up too. If she did want to look, she should have done just about anything differently than what she actually did...

I agree with Nyzer. Emi is a bitch in my eyes, and no good ending can change that fact.

Emi's bad ending is the only one I've done, and for some reason it didn't faze me too much. Maybe because I had done the good ending first, so in my mind the bad ending wasn't "real."

Should I try going for the other bad endings, by the way? Given how I cried like a bitch at all five good endings, I'm not sure if my heart can take it.

Emi's bad ending was brutal -- the worse one in the game IMNSHO. Even though I got the good ending first, the bad ending almost ruined the entire arc for me. In hindsight I kind of wish that I had not played it. I only did it for the 100% complete, but that was maybe too high a price to pay.

On the flip side, doing the bad endings gives you a fuller understanding of the girls, and gives them more depth. I got to know an aspect of Emi that I didn't much care for, but that may be better than being willfully ignorant

Ok it's been a while since I've played her path, but doesn't virtually every side character come give you advice on her at some point during the path? You have to ignore pretty much everything they tell you to get her bad ending. Mutou pretty much flat out tells you what you need to do to get her good end. Or you just have to ignore them all and not talk to them, being single mindedly focused on Emi. Again, keep in mind, when you are making choices in the game, you aren't only choosing what Hisao will say, you are forming his very personality. If you ignore everyone, and always follow Emi everywhere she goes, the personality you form for him is kind of a clingy freak. And this isn't even going into Emi's own personality, which is far more similar to Hanako than it seems on the surface. Emi is also a deconstruction of white knighting, and if you keep pressing her about her issues, you are trying to "fix" her, which is pretty much the antithesis of what this game is about.

russianspy1234 wrote:if you keep pressing her about her issues, you are trying to "fix" her.

Actually, you're really just trying to have a basic healthy relationship with her, which she refuses because "Waaa, I don't like getting close to people!". The bad ending is as much Emi's fault as Hisao's. It's Hanako's bad end that really comes from trying to "fix" her.

Xanatos wrote: Actually, you're really just trying to have a basic healthy relationship with her, which she refuses because "Waaa, I don't like getting close to people!". The bad ending is as much Emi's fault as Hisao's.

I completely agree, both parties are at fault for this.
Partly Hisao because although he acknowledges that Emi doesn't want a white knight to help her, he still tries to aid her and ends up in the bad ending

On the flip side, Emi's stubborn nature means that although she knows that Hisao truly cares for her, she doesn't want to accept the help because as she says, she doesn't like getting close to people and thus ignores help.

However, you can't blame either of them for what they did though which is why I feel this ending has a strong element of realism because Hisao acted like any boyfriend would if they were worried about their girlfriend and you can understand Emi's fear of losing another person she held close to her heart which is why she detaches herself from most other people.

The ending certainly wasn't the biggest heartbreak for me but it was second to Rin's neutral.

Lolzster wrote:

Xanatos wrote: Actually, you're really just trying to have a basic healthy relationship with her, which she refuses because "Waaa, I don't like getting close to people!". The bad ending is as much Emi's fault as Hisao's.

I completely agree, both parties are at fault for this.
Partly Hisao because although he acknowledges that Emi doesn't want a white knight to help her, he still tries to aid her and ends up in the bad ending

On the flip side, Emi's stubborn nature means that although she knows that Hisao truly cares for her, she doesn't want to accept the help because as she says, she doesn't like getting close to people and thus ignores help.

However, you can't blame either of them for what they did though which is why I feel this ending has a strong element of realism because Hisao acted like any boyfriend would if they were worried about their girlfriend and you can understand Emi's fear of losing another person she held close to her heart which is why she detaches herself from most other people.

The ending certainly wasn't the biggest heartbreak for me but it was second to Rin's neutral.

The irony is Emi's bullshit is the reason she lost Hisao. And Rin has no neutral ending. Only good, bad, and "OH GOD IT HURTS".

Just pointing out, for those of you where it wasn't blatantly obvious, every bad ending is due to errors on Hisao's part and errors on the girl's fault. Specifically, you (the player) influence Hisao to make decisions that specifically agitate the girls, leading to an escalating reaction where the relationship dissolves and everyone walks away feeling miserable. Every. Single. One.

I'd almost go so far as to say the main conflict in each arc has to do with Hisao mirroring the worst aspects of the girl in question, but I haven't gone over the details in enough depth to affirm that statement.

Emi gives off mixed signals because she's confused. She likes Hisao, and likes what they have, but she's afraid of caring for him, because she doesn't want to lose someone she cares for.

It's not about white knighting. She claims it is because that lays the blame on Hisao. If Hisao's a domineering jerk who pretends to be nice for his own self-serving reasons, Emi's justified in leaving him, right? Right?

She invites him to the house for the same reason she has sex with him - so he feels like he's in a meaningful relationship without her actually investing any meaning into the relationship.

By the time she starts pushing Hisao away, it's too late - she's afraid of becoming attached to Hisao because she's already become attached to him. So she runs. You may have noticed, that's her thing.

On the flip side, BadEmi Hisao refuses to open up to anyone. He doesn't need to connect with other people (Emi excepted), rejects help from those in the best position to offer it, and most certainly won't open up to the loud airhead who's expressing concern (for a change). The Emi situation is something he can't handle, and he doesn't want anyone else's help, so he starts running himself.

Also, for all her talk, Emi doesn't give up on Hisao. Hisao gives up on her. Emi doesn't make it easy, by any means, but it's Hisao who actually disengages.

ProfAllister wrote:Also, for all her talk, Emi doesn't give up on Hisao.

How is Hisao actually trying to salvage things and Emi blatantly refusing to bother not giving up?

He means she isn't the one who first gives up, I think.
After a week of him basically pretending she didn't exist (and her doing the same), his attempt at the track in the Bad Ending was pretty pathetic.

Xanatos wrote:

russianspy1234 wrote:if you keep pressing her about her issues, you are trying to "fix" her.

Actually, you're really just trying to have a basic healthy relationship with her, which she refuses because "Waaa, I don't like getting close to people!". The bad ending is as much Emi's fault as Hisao's. It's Hanako's bad end that really comes from trying to "fix" her.

He was too aggressive about it though. My first run through Emi's path, I was in that situation, and stayed to talk to her mom. She gave me advice about it, and Emi and Hisao ended up having the conversation they needed to have. It's not about not pursuing the situation at all, its about pursuing properly. I am trying to remember what you say in particular that pisses her off if you follow her right away, but I do recall there being something...

russianspy1234 wrote:

Xanatos wrote:

russianspy1234 wrote:if you keep pressing her about her issues, you are trying to "fix" her.

Actually, you're really just trying to have a basic healthy relationship with her, which she refuses because "Waaa, I don't like getting close to people!". The bad ending is as much Emi's fault as Hisao's. It's Hanako's bad end that really comes from trying to "fix" her.

He was too aggressive about it though.

And? Does that somehow negate that Emi's equally at fault?

Honestly, any self-respecting protagonist in a cripple porn game would have just nailed her mom instead like half the players wanted to anyway. Hisao does not deserve to wear that sweatervest.