Katawa Shoujo Forums

Lattyware wrote:I read through, and although many people, and I could, say 'so what, artistic licence', I don't think it's the best option.

Obviously, the disease should be matched to the requirement of the game, but I, for one, know how annoyed I get when I see TV shows blatently making up computing stuff.

If one knows about a subject, it is incredibly annoying to see people not having done good research and actually made something believealbe.

Having a piece of work ruined for one in this method is commonly referred to as being "Dan Browned".

We used the term "arrhythmia" because it was a little less obvious than "weak heart".

Yes, you are correct on a number of fronts. But, as you rightly say, is a high school student going ot know the intimate details of his condition?
Probably not. It may well be that some other condition caused the arrhythmia he experienced in the opening scene.

Yes, some of the medications we listed may only have been used when he was in the hospital, and others after he has left.

We *could* have sent him to California for a heart transplant. We could have given him a pacemaker (Actually, in a version of the Hanako path that will never see the light of day, he *did* get a pacemaker). But those options involve him staying in hospital for some time and not going to Yamaku.

So, yes, congratulations, you caught us. Apart from SilentCook, we are not medical experts. Sure, it's not 100% accurate, but nor is he travelling through time, summoning fictional heros through a portal in his back shed, or shooting lasers from his eyes.

At this juncture, we will most likely not be changing the ECG in the OP nor the reference to arrhythima.

PS: I know this will sound like a bore, but if you break up long passages with "enter" a bit it makes it easier to read.

I wondered why you didn't give him a pacemaker as well, but I just assumed it was some rare disease that couldn't be fixed with it.

As a nursing student, I feel kinda embarrassed that I didn't see the inconsistency of the sinus rhythm in the opening. I managed to read a paragraph or two before giving up as I've already done stuff like this before and don't want to do so again. Anyway the only thing important to know about is that he has cardiac arrhythmia and that there is nothing he can do about it.

cpl_crud wrote: Sure, it's not 100% accurate, but nor is he ... shooting lasers from his eyes.

He needs to do this.

Or at least think he can when drunk or something.

Chicago Ted wrote:

cpl_crud wrote: Sure, it's not 100% accurate, but nor is he ... shooting lasers from his eyes.

He needs to do this.

Or at least think he can when drunk or something.

Or make it a side effect of his arrythmia. You can sell it as being linked to the missing P-wave. Due to some unexplainable abnormality of his nervous system, the wave runs straight to his eyes giving him the ability to shoot lasers.

Explains the missing P-wave on the ECG and gives him laser eyes. Everybody wins!

Ohohoho, lots of good comments. There were 2 posts that summarized everyone's comments pretty well:

cpl_crud wrote:We used the term "arrhythmia" because it was a little less obvious than "weak heart".

ah, I see. But why go for a less obvious term? It makes it more mysterious for people who don't know as much about medicine and healthcare, but for those that do it seems a bit strange. for me personally it 'broke the third wall' Of course, i long ago accepted the fact i'll just have to get over it. haha.

cpl_crud wrote: Yes, you are correct on a number of fronts. But, as you rightly say, is a high school student going ot know the intimate details of his condition?
Probably not. It may well be that some other condition caused the arrhythmia he experienced in the opening scene.

This was the original thought that entered my mind. The MC just got confused. very likely. but oh! what's this!? some other condition caused the initial problem!? that sounds exciting.

cpl_crud wrote: Yes, some of the medications we listed may only have been used when he was in the hospital, and others after he has left.

ahhhhhh

cpl_crud wrote: We *could* have sent him to California for a heart transplant. We could have given him a pacemaker (Actually, in a version of the Hanako path that will never see the light of day, he *did* get a pacemaker). But those options involve him staying in hospital for some time and not going to Yamaku.

I probably wouldn't have liked that anyway. sounds boring XP. I was just curious.

cpl_crud wrote: So, yes, congratulations, you caught us. Apart from SilentCook, we are not medical experts. Sure, it's not 100% accurate, but nor is he travelling through time, summoning fictional heros through a portal in his back shed, or shooting lasers from his eyes.

PEWPEWPEW

cpl_crud wrote: At this juncture, we will most likely not be changing the ECG in the OP nor the reference to arrhythima.

That would be a lot of work. I'm glad to know you guys were aware of the problems, and not just randomly throwing facts in. Upon analysis everything seems to be well thought out, I'm very impressed, but i was still curious enough to make a post.

cpl_crud wrote: PS: I know this will sound like a bore, but if you break up long passages with "enter" a bit it makes it easier to read.

I guess you wouldn't want to see the original, un-edited post. but i agree, my post was a bit massive and hard to read.

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TKPsycho wrote:omg, incorrect or incomplete medical facts in a work of fiction? The world must end.

You can say that because you are ignorant. for those of us that understand the science, it makes the game less enjoyable. all the doctors are idiots? that doesn't make sense. as a side note (and before i get flamed), ignorance is different from stupidity. stupid people get offended when they are called ignorant. I made the post to help educate some people, if they are interested in the science. NOT to just pick apart every detail. I support the project, or i wouldn't have said anything, 'cause i wouldn't care. My post is mainly to satisfy my own curiosity as to why things were done the way they were so i can enjoy the game more, and also to educate some who know a bit, but maybe not as much as i do.

TKPsycho wrote: You're really picking it apart too much. I see things in novels that are incorrect ALL THE TIME. Even by authors that spend quite a lot of time researching the subjects that they're talking about. Unless the plot itself hinges on exact details of the subject matter, it's not worth worrying over. In this case we know he has a serious heart condition. They give a name to it because it's nice to have a name to put to it. Other than the fact that he has to take meds, and can't exert himself too much, that's all we really need to know for the plot. Heart condition, got it. Get off the scientific facts and get into the story and the characters.

That's the thing, the plot COULD hinge on this fact, namely if he later gets treatment, it's based on what his real condition is. This comes back to the ignorance comment. It's not your fault, you just dont' know, so you couldnt' possibly understand.

You're right, all we need to know is his can't exert himself and he takes a lot of meds, but we are given more info than that, and things can be inferred, thus the problem.

TKPsycho wrote: ETA: Actually read some of your post now. The game you're thinking of is Narcissu, and there is a HUGE FREAKING PAGE dedicated the medical conditions the characters face. I could do without reading it, but as I understand it there are inconsistencies there, too.

That's not it. I purchased and played it late 90's or early 2000. Unfortunately i have since lost the discs. My precious collection *cry*. But i remember there being 2 or 3 sisters. It might have been tokimeki memorial too. It's been too long, i just can't remember. That game looks 1. Free and 2. much newer. 3. interesting o.o Thanks. I'll have to check it out.

In regards to not using "weak heart" I was always VERY glad they went with something more specific. Because when it comes to anime, "weak heart" just screams other terms like "weak constitution" or "I have the magical "I'm frail and have weak body disease" and it makes me faint or become bed-ridden when the plot demands it" sickness. Yuck!

Ah yeah, reread what you wrote about the game. You weren't talking about Narcissu, but thaz okay. Now I want to know what it was. It's okay, I'm from the internet. I will find it. >.<

BTW: You mistake lack of caring for ignorance. You have no idea how much I do or do not understand about this subject. You are right - being ignorant is different from being stupid, and in this case I am neither. I am merely apathetic.

Pimmy wrote:In regards to not using "weak heart" I was always VERY glad they went with something more specific. Because when it comes to anime, "weak heart" just screams other terms like "weak constitution" or "I have the magical "I'm frail and have weak body disease" and it makes me faint or become bed-ridden when the plot demands it" sickness. Yuck!

Yeah, that always bothers me a bit. Characters that just have frail bodies with no reason whatsoever are a little annoying. "Weak heart" is worlds better than "weak body" though.

Most of the choices regarding the medical terminology are completely conscious (pimmy is mostly right in her assessment), and the ECG in opening has nothing to do with Hisao's heart.

Yeah, there was some research put into it. It wasn't just random terminology that the Devs heard from a medical movie and decided to put in. I'm glad they didn't use an obvious and generic term like "weak heart". The opening scene itself, I didn't see it as linked with Hisao's condition. That I think you're reading too far into, it was just an opening animation for the game. Though I do understand how you can be slightly annoyed when seeing inconsistencies about a subject you're knowledgeable in. I actually learned quite a bit from your post, and I'm glad you brought it up. Like many have said, its not like the average person who's reading this will actually have the medical knowledge to spot the flaws in this. There was obviously research put into it, and it may not be perfect but it shows that a hell of a lot more work was done than if they kept it at"weak heart".

The only thing I have a problem with is the fact that a guy with an arrhythmia has to go to a school for disabled children. Seems highly unlikely to me. All he has to do is take his meds, and make sure not to overly stimulate his heart by running too much and stuff right? Why the need to go to an entire new school?

Silent Xenocide wrote:The only thing I have a problem with is the fact that a guy with an arrhythmia has to go to a school for disabled children. Seems highly unlikely to me. All he has to do is take his meds, and make sure not to overly stimulate his heart by running too much and stuff right? Why the need to go to an entire new school?

Because if he didnt then we would have no game.

I think having factual authority over a subject in a story can go a long way toward credibility, but I can also see where getting super anal specific about a vice whose effects are simple can be a distraction that the staff (and specifically the writers) didn't want to elaborate further on can be understandable.

Both sides concerns and points are valid. There's really no point taking sides in this. The deed is done, so let's all look forward to the remainder of the story together as I'm sure the writer's are being as careful as possible with the subject matter.

Silent Xenocide wrote:The only thing I have a problem with is the fact that a guy with an arrhythmia has to go to a school for disabled children. Seems highly unlikely to me. All he has to do is take his meds, and make sure not to overly stimulate his heart by running too much and stuff right? Why the need to go to an entire new school?

You know how parents are, overly protective, so sending him to a school where there is a 24-hour watch by some sort of medical staff and knowing your kid has a "disability" would sound like a obvious thing to do.

PS. Though I like the other reason better, that Kamisha misha gave.