Hanako's Broken Heart Club

[bhtooefr]

A BMI chart without a scale would be pretty useless, no? (Although it'd at least be quite easy to carry one. I mean, it's not that much JavaScript to do a webpage to just calculate BMI from a given height and weight.)

In any case, weight doesn't actually matter unless you're in the habit of carrying your partner (or there's some sexual positions that'd be easier with a lighter partner, but that falls under "carrying your partner"). Some people can be quite slim yet quite heavy - muscle is heavy, for instance, and someone who's quite muscular and has a little fat over top of the muscle can actually have an overweight or even obese BMI while still being perfectly healthy and not looking obese (or in some cases overweight) at all.

I'll note that I don't meet my own aesthetic standards, but then again, being male also disqualifies me from my own aesthetic standards, so I'm OK with my double standard there. (My aesthetic ideal for a partner, in KS terms, is somewhere between Emi and Akira's body types, FWIW, although my standards are definitely wider than that. I'm definitely not that body type myself.)

I also don't meet my own emotional standards, though, and that's a bigger one. I probably wouldn't date someone who has my issues because I couldn't deal with that, so why should I inflict my own issues on someone else?

[Zarys]

I don't think that's the problem, just that many people can't find attractive someone who is too overweight, even if that person is relatively ok.

[LilyKitsune]

I'll note that I don't meet my own aesthetic standards, but then again, being male also disqualifies me from my own aesthetic standards, so I'm OK with my double standard there. (My aesthetic ideal for a partner, in KS terms, is somewhere between Emi and Akira's body types, FWIW, although my standards are definitely wider than that. I'm definitely not that body type

Somewhere between slender with still perfect curves, and athletic. Quite a range.

Eh, I eat healthy, and keep from being overweight, but I dont do weight training and such. Skinnyfat woo. No curves here.

[bhtooefr]

I did note that my range of acceptability was definitely wider than my ideal, just that that was my ideal, FWIW. (And, in my headcanon, Akira tends towards athletic too, actually, being a swimmer in her spare time.)

And, for the record, I'm... overweight. At least the weather's cooling off such that I can cycle commute reasonably again...

[Zarys]

I did note that my range of acceptability was definitely wider than my ideal

You are far from being unique.

[LilyKitsune]

I did note that my range of acceptability was definitely wider than my ideal, just that that was my ideal, FWIW. (And, in my headcanon, Akira tends towards athletic too, actually, being a swimmer in her spare time.)

And, for the record, I'm... overweight. At least the weather's cooling off such that I can cycle commute reasonably again...

Well good luck, then.

[Eurobeatjester]

I personally don't mind someone who is a little overweight. I've lost about 40 lbs myself this last year with another 40 to go before I hit my goal and I just feel better. It was hard, but the results have been worth it.

It's not specifically an overweight thing, it's just people in denial about their appearance or situations in general. You can be skinny and still dress or carry yourself with absolutely no self respect, and to me that's just as much as a turn off as someone who's heavily overweight and complains about their genetics while going back to the buffet for their fourth plate of food.

I know because I used to be that guy going back for fourths

[Khalego]

^ I'm the guy who'll go back for fourths then make a fat joke about it, because I can be a glutton and still respect myself fine.

[Lockhart]

Okay, Lockheart. Nice to see your posting again, I know your first thread went up in flame(wars), and that has a tendency to scare people off very easily.

My first thread was a success - there was a number of quality comments, I got away with mentioning Shizune's alpha story, nothing got deleted or locked. I could have posted the same text to some manosphere site, but that would be just preaching to the choir. And I'd get called a faggot for enjoying a visual novel about dating disabled girls, ha ha.

But I agree with you on some levels. No mate is worth killing yourself over, and no-one should ever have the power to destroy you so completely without you having the same power over them. M.A.D. applies in my relationships, I guess. Crying over a mate is something you should be able to do though. Don't Freud me here, but if something bad happened to my mother, I'd be sad, because that's a perfectly normal human reaction. Ditto really anyone I know. As Potato once criticized, however, I would die for two people at any time, but that's just math. And no human being is truly replaceable (yet) since they are a bundle of memories, thoughts, and interactions that have made them who they are today. That information is useful. But there are expendable humans.

As far as I can tell we don't disagree at anything important.

There's one comment I want to address. It said that while there's no ultimate THE ONE, you have a power to chose your THE ONE, which in effect becomes one and trully THE ONE.

Wrong.

The moment you start to treat your girl as the only one, the princess, sweetypie, you will signal that she has complete power over you. There is nothing more resentful to a woman than a guy who sees her as an only option.

Because that means he doesn't have other options, which in turn means his value is low. He stops being a man and becomes a dog.

Youtube "marriage proposal fail". What's a common trait of those guys? See how feminine/out of shape/nerdy they all are? See how submissive their posture is, how quick are they to kneel and call their woman the best thing in the entire world, ever?

I dare you to find 1 video of a well built, masculine, confident guy proposing and getting rejected.

Treat women with respect and, if it comes to that, love. But be aware of your own value as a man, and understand that the fantasy of every woman is to be with an alpha male, who could cheat if he wanted to, but doesn't.

Shizune picked Hisao because she thought he has the potential to be that alpha. He failed. In the "good ending" he's friendzoned, determined to "keep chasing" (literal quote from the game) her. Pro tip: if you have to chase your girlfriend, chances are he's not actually your girlfriend.

PS: My original post is available again a thread you're reading: http://ks.renai.us/viewtopic.php?f=13&t ... 75#p213728, there was a slight mix up which has been resolved now.

[LilyKitsune]

There's one comment I want to address. It said that while there's no ultimate THE ONE, you have a power to chose your THE ONE, which in effect becomes one and trully THE ONE.

Wrong.

The moment you start to treat your girl as the only one, the princess, sweetypie, you will signal that she has complete power over you. There is nothing more resentful to a woman than a guy who sees her as an only option.

Because that means he doesn't have other options, which in turn means his value is low. He stops being a man and becomes a dog.

Youtube "marriage proposal fail". What's a common trait of those guys? See how feminine/out of shape/nerdy they all are? See how submissive their posture is, how quick are they to kneel and call their woman the best thing in the entire world, ever?

I dare you to find 1 video of a well built, masculine, confident guy proposing and getting rejected.

Treat women with respect and, if it comes to that, love. But be aware of your own value as a man, and understand that the fantasy of every woman is to be with an alpha male, who could cheat if he wanted to, but doesn't.

Shizune picked Hisao because she thought he has the potential to be that alpha. He failed. In the "good ending" he's friendzoned, determined to "keep chasing" (literal quote from the game) her. Pro tip: if you have to chase your girlfriend, chances are he's not actually your girlfriend.

PS: My original post is available again a thread you're reading: http://ks.renai.us/viewtopic.php?f=13&t ... 75#p213728, there was a slight mix up which has been resolved now.

Oh ew. What a bunch of forced dilemma bullshit. Your marriage proposal thing is silly. There are so many other potential factors that could influence that. And the decision to "be alpha and act like you could cheat at any time" or "be left like a bitch" which is so pitifully narrow, I wonder where you're getting your philosophy from. It most definitely isn't direct observation. You'd see relationships of all varieties. And you'd see that less people are generally rushing into marriage, as there are now more sigle people than married for the first time since records. Why? Certainly isnt due to a shortage of "alphas" but because more women want to have their own career set before getting into marriage, whereas that never used to be a problem.

And your "fantasy of every woman" thing is stupid on a whole other level. To draw a parallel, imagine if insecure tumblr idiots said in regards to this game that "the dream of every man is to be with someone like Lilly" then listed archaic definitions of what femininity is, marked them as the supreme goal of everyone, and built false dilemmas and statistic manipulation around it. Lets look at it in a more basic sense.

The term "alpha". Did we start using it (for people recently) because it was truly the most apt definition? It's a comparison. What do insecure people always always do? They compare. They look at others and compare themselves. This alpha thing started with people that were insecure and did these comparisons while valuing themselves lower. Instead of correctly assessing that the problem was comparing themselves at all, they thought it was the part where they valued themselves lower than others. So they thought the solution was to keep comparing, but value themselves higher. Insecurity is insecurity. Playing the game of comparisons is losing. I say this as someone firmly stuck in thr game in regards to half of myself. When I am positive about my inner self, I dont describe myself in comparisons. When im negative about my physical traits, I do little but compare. Im just unsure how to stop.
The difference is, I know the solution isnt to mark myself better in the comparison. That is what all self identifying "alphas" do. It isn't confidence. It's fake.

Tldr: "alpha" is a bullshit term, and people have varying tastes in other people.

[bhtooefr]

Yay, just what this forum needed, "the game"/pickup artist bullshit.

While I agree with the idea that Shizune isn't Hisao's girlfriend (and wrote a fanfic where Hanako white-knighted the shit out of him to get him to actually dump Shizune), I'll note that treating women as a goal, not people, and tricking them into dating you... well, it may well work for casual sex, but not for a meaningful relationship.

[Munchenhausen]

I don't think that's the problem, just that many people can't find attractive someone who is too overweight, even if that person is relatively ok.

I don't think that's always possible...
The way I see it, you need a combination of Emotional Attachment and Physical Attraction to fall romantically in love with someone/something.

As a human being, you're naturally capable of loving anyone. You love your family, you love your best friend, you love your pet etc etc.
However upon the addition of sexual/physical attraction, loving someone can potentially become being in love with someone.

For example, I love my friend Ben. I would jump a bullet for him, I'd trust him with my life, I'd happily loan him copious amounts of money if he needed it. If I was a homosexual I may go further and wind up falling in love with him, but alas I am not and therefore my love remains platonic.

I feel it explains why incestuous couples exist, and some people into bestiality claim to be romantically involved with their animal. Just a theory.

tl;dr
Although looks aren't everything, they're detrimental to a strong romantic relationship
If you don't like your girls chunky, you probably wont date one who is.

[metalangel]

Yay, just what this forum needed, "the game"/pickup artist bullshit.

While I agree with the idea that Shizune isn't Hisao's girlfriend (and wrote a fanfic where Hanako white-knighted the shit out of him to get him to actually dump Shizune), I'll note that treating women as a goal, not people, and tricking them into dating you... well, it may well work for casual sex, but not for a meaningful relationship.

Wow, this is a serious can of worms we’re opening here, folks.

This whole alpha vs beta/man up bullshit swirls around dating and relationship sites. There’s books like ‘No More Mr Nice Guy’ and ‘The Married Man’s Sex Life Primer’ encouraging exactly that kind of ‘stepping up’ and ‘retaking your masculinity’ and not being a pushover.

I think there’s a big difference between not being a doormat and being a jerk, however. So much crap is spewed about being manly and a real man and what a real man should do as opposed to just being yourself and having confidence and self respect behind it. I worry that it leads to the unrealistic expectations as Lockhart has given that a well built, masculine and confident guy won’t get rejected, because that suggests only those sort of guys will succeed.

Suffice it to say that there are some screwed up people and screwed up ideas out there about love and sex and relationships, and it’s easy to see why some people would go through a succession of unhappy dates and relationships and would therefore be more inclined to cling to someone halfway decent they’ve found for fear they won’t find anything better.

As for Hisao and Shizune? He’s not in the friendzone. Once you’ve had sex with them, you’ve left the friendzone and enter another state entirely. Even if you don’t become FWBs, you’ve crossed a line that cannot be uncrossed and you both know it.

[bhtooefr]

Oh, I don't think Shizune had "friendzoned" Hisao at all, but that it was a FWB situation, and Hisao wanted it to be more than that.

[metalangel]

The perils of posting on a phone: multiple quotes are a pain in the ass.